Ante Milicic edit
Thu, Feb 22, 2024 8:48PM • 42:39
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
coach, work, croatia, players, team, coaching, australia, people, bit, put, game, football, career, world cup, understand, culture, macarthur, club, resigned, years
SPEAKERS
Paul Barnett, ante Milicic
Paul Barnett 00:00
Hey, Milosevic. Hello, good evening, my time. Good morning, your time and welcome to the Great coach's podcast.
ante Milicic 00:07
Good evening. For you over there in beautiful Australia and thanks for having me on your show. Could
Paul Barnett 00:15
I start with a question whose answer I know it's gonna make me a little bit jealous, but where are you in the world and what have you been up to so far today?
ante Milicic 00:24
Okay, so I'm in Zagreb, Croatia, which of course is the capital. It's getting cold now the snow is starting to fall and we're getting ready for a beautiful white Christmas and Advent which is very popular here in Zagreb. So looking forward to that tender, you know, still doing a bit of work with, with football and I'm, and I'm involved with a bit of consultancy work with a few clubs here. So thicken over at a nice tempo and in enjoying myself.
Paul Barnett 00:59
Well, I look forward to talking to you a little bit more about as I grab off air afterwards, one of my favorite cities in Europe, for sure, especially in summer, I don't know what it's like in winter, but summer is always pretty good. And then, of course, it's a great sporting nation. We've seen them, you know, perform so well in the Soccer World Cup and in water polo as well, but I'm sure we'll get into that as we go along. I'd say Could I start by just asking you about some of the coaches you've had experience with? There's a couple of big names in there. There's, there's Tony Popovich. There's Ange Postecoglou. And there's Bert van Malik, who I don't know as well. But having read his background, I can see that he's very well credentialed. And I'm just intrigued to start by asking you, having watched these people up close, and the many others that you've coached against, what is it you think the Great Ones do differently that sets them apart?
ante Milicic 01:54
Yeah, I've, I've been very fortunate to work with not only good coaches, but the good people. And I think for all young coaches, they get into the industry, I think it's very important who you work under. And, you know, when when I look at that list, I'd also add to that list, John bench kept, who's the current coach of IX now was as well. And there was another gentleman who coached our young Socceroos yarnover sly and I did two World Youth cups with chemo, who was also very good coach, when when you ask what sets them apart, I mean, they're, they're all different individuals, obviously. But what really stands out to me is that the standards that they have, and the consistency that comes with that, so you know, it's how you present yourself, and you conduct yourself and you you run, you know, the the organization everyday through your not only your words, but your your actions. And it sounds basic enough, but to be able to do that day in, day out, consistently at a higher level. I think that's what really makes the great coaches what they are. And you know, just just to touch on it a little bit you look at now, I've been fortunate to get to a couple of World Cups, but you know, the teams that win the World Cup, I'm looking at him a little bit different to the ones that get eliminated early and I'm not putting perform putting performance to one side. But you know, you need to be away from from home for 45 days, sometimes without seeing your family breakfast, lunch and dinner together as a team, video reviews, previews, pressure expectations, media. Now, that's where it comes back to those consistency in the high standards, your you've got to maintain that every every day and great coaches can do that. And there's, there's no drop off, that you can't afford to to have it at that top level. And so when you talk about those coaches, that's what really stands out to me.
Paul Barnett 04:08
Or from the great coaches. Let's let's rewind to the start. Well, not quite the start, but you grew up in in Sydney's west, to parents who emigrated to Australia and I'm, I'm wondering, I know that would have been a challenging experience back then. And equally a fun experience as well. But I'm wondering how that experience is visible today in the way that you lead teams.
ante Milicic 04:33
It will, I think you link a lot of your, your, your way of working to your to your upbringing or or I certainly did, and then when you mentioned you know, the the immigrant parents. So you take that into your into your coaching and so the minimum expectations and then is hard work, because you see what your parents went through when you I will not when I look back, and as you rolled in here, you understand a little bit more about their life and their reasoning to come to Australia render, I mean, I just look at the basic one of my father, you know, traveling 32 days on a boat to get to Australia to a country where he had no money, no friends, no relatives didn't know the language. But you know what, he just got on with it any any work every day, and I'll put it seem in the mornings when I wake up because it was at work. And he'd come over at six o'clock at night and, and have dinner and and then basically, you know, fall asleep on the couch or that exhausted so you bring that into the way? Well, I certainly didn't in the way I approach things. So that, you know, you talk about hard work, but you've got to do everything for your family, and you and your team and your club becomes your family, you want to you want to give them the best. That's, that's why that's why you you become a coach, you want to, you know, help help your players help the staff, you want to improve them, you want them to enjoy the benefits of, of the work that you put in. So, you know, I'll relate, you know, my my parents and, and, and my upbringing to what I bring into, you know, the the organization that I work with[PB1]
Paul Barnett 06:17
this idea of hard work, it flows through your story, as we'll we'll see, as we progress through the interview, but I have got an interesting quote from you that I'd like to play back to you before I ask the question. It's about your time as a player, and you said, I don't have so many regrets. But I thought definitely for the talent I had, I probably should have made a little bit more of my career. And it's an interesting one, because what I'd like to ask you is, how do you now go about working with people today? Who are potentially not realizing their potential, like you are saying that you did?
ante Milicic 06:56
And how common is it? I still see it now all the time. You know, so many good players, you know, whether that you've worked with them, or your, you know, coached against them, or you've followed their careers or, particularly when you you work in those younger age groups, like those a World Youth cups, those under 19 players, you know, where did their careers go? And, and, and why and, you know, I think now even also, you're a lot more accessible to that kind of information. You know, I know that there's a there's a popular clip on social media with Jose Mourinho and Delhi Ali talking about how quickly your your career goes and how time flies and you want to make the most of it because you give your hot or to play at a high level, you're giving your whole childhood to football and enter your, your your family that's committed to the career and then, you know, once it big turns to professional, it's how do you get the most out of it? So you got all will definitely, definitely say in terms of my own experience, and now looking back at it, yeah, I thought I was war could have could have done a lot more and you look at everyone's individual journey, and where things could have maybe been better. I think the big one is who you surround yourself with having a mentor, not only getting good advice, but actually acting on on that advice? And what are your motivations to succeed? You know, I'll look at my own my own story. And I, I grew up, you know, at 16 Going through the AAS program in Canberra, where there was only 18 players in the whole Australian chosen to go there. And the 91 World Youth Cup in in Portugal, well, Australia got to the semifinals was such a motivation for me to play in two years time in the in the 93 World Youth Cup. And, and all so focused on that tournament that I will do whatever it took to get there. And then we'll look at sort of my own individual story. You know, in in in 91, my mother passed away and I was just turned 17. And my mum, my mum died with cancer. So it was a it was a sort of a drawn out this unfortunately, but I had so much in me to perform at that 93 World Cup which I which I did well individually also as a team because we made the semi final and probably where I get a comment from is that after that, I had a big, big dip.
And I think a lot of it has to do with being mentally strong enough focus that people around me I had opportunities to go to to Europe. You know coming from Australia over a semi professional, hot, go to Europe where it's cold and snowy and it's, you know, six, seven sessions a day, or wasn't built to withstand that. And then my my own career took a dip from 19 to 22, you know, didn't make the Australian Olympic team in Atlanta 96. And then that's what triggered me. So that's what triggered me when I, when I knew I should have been in the team or I was good enough to get into it. And then I had that one season after that, that 97 season where I played really well. And then I got to move to Holland on the back of that. So again, it's, it's what's the motivating factor every everyone's different? Their, their background? Who's around them? How can we help them to succeed? And so as a coach, if you can get through to those individuals, because they're a specific type of, of players? And there are a lot of them is, can you make a difference? Can you can you help them out with your advice and, and steer them in the right direction. But, you know, with with the game and what's involved with that, today, it's a lot more, it's a lot more difficult I feel[PB2]
Paul Barnett 11:11
when I get into this idea of connecting with athletes, players, people, because you've coached at youth level, you've coached men, you've coached women. You've coached, you've played in the Netherlands, Croatia, Malaysia, Australia, and you've coached Australian teams all over the world, now you're living in, in Croatia, I'm really intrigued to understand what you've learned about effective communication from this very global and international journey.
ante Milicic 11:43
And all the especially when you're traveling abroad, and you're a foreigner in the country is about, you know, understanding their culture, you know, and I think you can do that through various ways. In, in, to, to be accepted or to fit in or to excel, in your role is, is where you have to have that effective communications with the local people. And whether that be the club or people connected with the club, or just the local community, I think that gives you a better chance of having an enjoyable experience. And I definitely found that through my, my time in, in Malaysia, and in Holland, and to this day have kept a lot of those relationships open and I think that's a big part of the, to the the experiences that we have along this journey and, and you look back at them with with fondness but again, it's that, you know, getting to understand that you're living in their country, and how can you be very open minded to, you know, the what the way it operates?[PB3]
Paul Barnett 13:00
This open mindedness, it's another facet of your story, people reference how calm you are and how nonreactive to situations you are and I, I'm fascinated about it, but I'd like to, I'd like to look at it through the lens of elite competition, if I could, because I think it's one. I think it's okay, it's one, one way to be that during day to day weekly competitions, but you've actually been to World Cups for men and for the women. And you've helped teams prepare, and I'm really intrigued. Is that does that preparation change an elite competition level? Or is it exactly the same?
ante Milicic 13:42
I look at it as being bad enough as an aeroplane Island, you know, you you need to be in control and make the right decisions because you're, you're, you know, looking after so many people in in the organization or that you're working with so that that calmness it comes a lot through obviously experienced but I think that's that gives the players confidence as well that they can they can see or or feel your reaction to certain situations but I also link it back to by being calm, at least on the exterior. It also assists my concentration a lot particularly when a game is going on that that calmness can can make make better informed decisions so I'm not really one to carry on and protest with opposition players or with referees or fourth officials or or media are a lot of that comes through your your preparation Shouldn't you have done and it has to be at a higher level to give you that opportunity of calmness, sender, I actually just feel that it's, it gives the players that, that security that they need to make their job a lot easier to execute.
Paul Barnett 15:17
Was it always that way enter or did it evolve as you moved along?
ante Milicic 15:21
It evolves because where does that come I mean, if I, if you look at your coach at the start of your career to now, you know, it's different. So a lot of it comes through experience. And again, this will refer back to particularly when you're a young coach, there's so many different parts of the game that you need to learn. But when you can be around good coaches work with good coaches, learn pick up things, travel, that's where where you you build a set, there's a there's a big difference, if you work under a particular coach for one year, compared to another one that you worked with five years, you might pick up more of that one that you worked with one year than the other one for five years, it depends what you're after, and what and what the level is, you know, like, I worked with endpoints to calculate for four years after working with him, that that always said, That's my PhD, I feel that prepared and confident to pretty much take any job because that's that level that have that have seen that have that have been able to witness that I understand the situations that are at or arise you just just go through that. That apprenticeship your career. And that evolves because of course when I when I started I wasn't like that. But you know, now over time you build your own sort of profile as a as a coach.[PB4]
Paul Barnett 16:52
We had, we've interviewed Anson Dorrance on the podcast, the the American Coach that led the led the women to the World Cup, the USA women to the World Cup, but he had this fascinating idea is like he was coached men and women. And he said, he said men have to perform to feel like they belong. But women need to feel like they belong in order to perform. It's I don't know whether you agree with it, but it's an intriguing idea. And I wanted to ask you, what you've learned about the power of belonging over your playing and coaching career?
ante Milicic 17:26
Well, it's a, it's a good statement, because that positive connection with the females is paramount. And I think the best way all up put up the differences and when I when I was appointed the coach of Matildas. I, I I also sought advice of other coaches that had work with males and females to say the differences but maybe I could just sum this up so you know, working with the with the men with the with the Socceroos you go, you know, 15 hours on the laptop, you know, working with the girls, it's 15 lattes, you know, a day it's different. They, they want that, that understanding, they want to be long, they want to know a little bit about the background, where do they see this thing? Are they all together where I felt with the with the min it's, it was a lot more individual, it's all about how to be ready for my training session and match day. [PB5] You know, I'll never forget 2014 In Brazil, Tim kale came up to me like 10 days before the first game, and he just said, I just want to know, how am I going to score against Chile, that was the start went away and went through, you know, clips, everything and I actually put together a presentation to him, how how, how he could get in a position to you know, score a goal against Chile. Whereas with the girls, it's, it's it's different, you know, you they have to be comfortable with where they are together as a group. And the dynamics are different, but I always worked off the, you know, the football is the most important part. So, you know, in the end, the game is the same, the rules are the same. And, you know, that's that's a lot of what I what I went through, but I really, really really enjoyed both experience and and I guess as a coach, when I first got into coaching, I never really said to myself, I want to do males or females or seniors or juniors always really, really open to to it all and to what opportunity came and I'm glad and I'm very thankful that I had the opportunity to work with these different age groups of both males and females because it might be a better coach and it may be a better person because there's a lot more understanding that goes involved in it.
Paul Barnett 19:59
Talk about the place where you may have used some of this understanding that when that said, MacArthur FC in Australia's elite because you were the inaugural coach and I'm, I'm interested, I wanted to learn what that experience taught you about setting up new team cultures from scratch.
ante Milicic 20:16
It's a difficult one because it's a startup club. And okay, you're the head coach. You've got limited facilities, limited resources, you need 23 players, you've got to bring in nine staff. How do you attract the players to MacArthur when you know, play that wants to come to Australia and Sydney in particular will first look at Sydney FC or wonder as to bigger clubs more established. So you talk about the culture, it's about forming cultures simply simply put, having the good people in and around the football club in in all areas, okay, so not just the dressing room, but that's from the groundsman to the to the front office to the to the staff because culture gets built by stairs and it can get the can get broken down, you know, in a minute, you know, so I found it difficult initially to to sign the type of footballers that I wanted for as I said those those reasons. I was fortunate enough that I fell back on all the years I worked with the Australian National team and I had a lot of former Socceroos that said that they'll come to McCarthy in the inaugural season. So I was getting players that were past their best, however, as professionals that that made up for it. So a lot of former soccer is Ziggy Oh, come on tea and I'll I'll be part of the new club and I'm thankful for like your Ivan furnitures. Your Mark Milligan's you told me yours your your Adam Federici again, all in their mid 30s. But they came so I sacrificed a little bit about my style of football. But I knew, you know, with players like you know, Melzi and Tommy or I knew that the dressing room was on remote control. I knew that that voice was the right one. And the message will be relaying how I wanted things to go. And I also thought that with the younger ones, then I was able to bring into the club. And what a way for them to learn and do their apprenticeship by having these spot pros that have had great careers. You know, God two World Cups played in Europe. Okay, this is what you're going to this is what you've got to deliver every day.
Paul Barnett 22:55
You mentioned something really interesting in there, you said cultures like building stairs, could you just pull that apart for us a little bit?
ante Milicic 23:05
Well, it doesn't happen overnight. It it takes time. And it's about getting the right people in the organization through the building and, and particularly for me at MacArthur when I'm bringing in 23 new players, you have to build and you've got to build that that crust you've got to build that respect that worked both ways. But one or two bad situations or you know, wrong characters, then it goes down in the left, it's broken, it's in there and then that gets dragged down with with a few others usually and then if you don't have the players and the staff together, pulling in the same direction, I believe you're gonna all even go as far to say that your culture and your atmosphere particularly in Australian football that's that could even be worth more than your tactics your art I'm a big believer in getting that that culture and that comes from your recruitment spot on that will that will give you a good chance of success because if you have if your game plans unbelievable but your team's not connected not right I find it's very very difficult if not impossible to succeed and get the results so that's why building MacArthur was such a such a such a big job and that you know like I said I'm thankful for those for those boys that came and in the end I forgot I had to forego a little bit on my my my style, but I I made up for it with with What I had in the in the change room and that and that meant a lot for me.[PB6]
Paul Barnett 25:03
Could I ask you a little bit about your style? I've seen in interviews where you say you're a little bit stubborn. But I'm wondering how you would describe, sometimes it's called philosophy or your coaching style. It
ante Milicic 25:18
may be that was slightly misinterpreted. But I look, I understand that one interview comes in mind for me, like, so that first year at MacArthur, you know, most, I think we had the most possession most passes in the opposition book there was opposition Boxer was the actual heavy, heavy, dominant, position based style of keeping the ball. And I remember getting asked a couple of times, well, you know, when the results don't go your way, you know, would you look at playing a more direct brand of football and there is, I understand the merit to that, and maybe I am stubborn, but I believe so much in the work that I've done in the preparation that I've done, that this is the right, this is the way that's going to bring us results. But in terms of my overall coaching, style, particularly with my staff, I'm very, very open to the opinions and to be challenged and to hear their thoughts on on what's going on. And I'm open to to hearing what others have to say. But in the end, of course, I'll make the you know, the captain's call, so to speak, if need be, but, you know, particularly go through my experiences when when you take over a team and I had this experience in I think it was 2018, I took the under 23 team to China and I was new to that role, because the previous coach had left just a month before in are sat down with with the coaches, and I want to understand their thoughts on how things were run and how they played. And then, of course, I'll make my own informed decision. But I didn't just come in straightaway say, Look, this is the way it's going to be with with certain things that I believe strongly. Yes, of course, it's, it's non negotiable, because that's who I am. And that's what I believe, what I believe so strongly in but are always happy to hear what other thinks in their opinion, because you come into an organization and and most occasions, you're working with people that are you know, at a at a good level, and you have to respect what they've done in the in the past and get an understanding as to why they they did it that way. The only thing is depends in what circumstances you're in, because usually in coaching times your enemy. So you know, you got to make those right decisions and usually make them pretty quick.
Paul Barnett 27:46
And I talk about taking over from someone in a typical situation. And that's when you came into the Matilda's you came in there after the sacking of the coach. And I'm wondering what you learned about working with groups, when the last leader is left in difficult circumstances.
ante Milicic 28:07
That was for for many reasons, I learned so much that was you know, taking over a job but like that, in those circumstances were were very difficult. I mean, I had never worked in, in women's football. You know, you're you're five months away from a World Cup where expectations are very high. Their former coach, you also had worked with a lot of those players from their early ages, had left in, in, in difficult circumstances, a lot of unknown. And, you know, most people that I spoke to thought that I was crazy for taking such a such a challenge. So close to a major tournament, but, you know, the two or three people that are really, really trusted their opinion and let new me saw it as a fantastic opportunity.
And that and that's the way I approached it, as well because in the end, you're you're coaching the country at a World Cup. It's it's difficult, it's a challenge, but that's the part that you love as a coach, you know, really do take over where everything's fine and smooth sailing. And so I knew who was there was a great opportunity for me. And, you know, I remember the amount of of research that I needed to do before even my first camp and one of the first things I did was, you know, two days before camps started, I had two days full of meetings where I've got every single staff member to present to me their role and their responsibly Ladies, so I wanted to get an understanding of, of how things were run from the basics to the more complicated areas, you know, what did a day look like? What did a week look like, you know, just who was in charge of what and how they did things. So then that way, I could then put my stamp on things as quickly as possible. And, you know, I really felt that that worked well with the staff. So the, you know, the first day I got there, amid all the staff, you know, they all presented to me, and then at night, there was a different side of nowhere, you know, it's a bit more calm and relaxed, and we all went out for dinner, and then, you know, it wasn't so much of a football conversation at the dinner table, and you've got to have that balance as well, in coaching, and, you know, we we speak about that personal connection, you know, a lot of people are interested in your, in your journey and know where you've come from, and where you live, and, to a certain degree that your family situation. So there's that other side that I think is important to, to some more than other others. [PB7]
But, you know, that was definitely the way I approached that. That Matilda's you know, job, and I look backward with huge satisfaction. And I'm very, very grateful for the opportunity and that one, that that, that job really, really taught me a lot and again, made me made me a lot more, you know, aware of, of a different side of, of working and coaching, because, again, with the national teams, you don't get them every day. You know, you get them for for 10 days, they come in, they go dependent a lot on, on what level they are in their club team, when they come in, you know, you've got to be so precise in the amount of information that you're giving them. And are you getting it right. So to take over that quickly? That sue me for a World Cup, there was a lot of work that needed to be done. Yeah.
Paul Barnett 32:12
Well, this is a busy period in your career. And it wasn't long after this, that you, you resigned from MacArthur and you know, there's that great quote, you say, I'm done, and I'm on empty. And that is the catalyst that, of course, takes you to where you are today in Croatia. But I wanted to ask you and take what have you, you know, when young coaches come to you there, and they talk to you about trying to find some balance and manage their workload, what advice do you give them? Knowing what you've gone through on maintaining their own energy?
ante Milicic 32:44
Yeah. Okay, I can now give you a few examples, because you've got to be in coaching for the right reasons. Okay. So you, you want to make a difference. You want to help the team, you want to help others. So I resigned from MacArthur where I had a year to go on my contract, so I forfeited my contract. Because I was done. I was on empty. So what does I was done an empty look like, so I'd coached for 14 years without a break. And I'd like to think that I go at a pretty solid level. Those last two years at MacArthur, there was obviously a lot of destructions with COVID. And most of us didn't know how to navigate through that period, with great confidence. And also at that time, my father passed away who lived in Croatia, and I just didn't get that closure. Okay, so I wasn't able to go to his funeral. I had to organize it while I was coaching and living in Australia or watched my dad's funeral on on an iPhone. And, and I knew that at the end of that second season, when I resigned, I just wanted to go to Croatia and take some time away from football. MacArthur were fantastic and said to me, you know, take two three months off, and and then you know, come back and join us when you need to in pre season but you can't put a timeframe on something like that. So I wanted to go through my father's apartment, I wanted to fix up the grave. I wanted to look at his letters, I wanted to look at his photos, and I didn't know how long that would would take and you know, even when I did resign, I actually got a really good offer from from from another team to coach and I declined it because, again, you don't take a job just for the sake of a job. Okay, so if you can't give them maximum, I would rather Walk or walk away from it, and you've got to get that balance, right, you've, you've got to, you've got, you've got to stay true to the game and show that respect. So that's why I say to young coaches is have that balance, right? You know, what you put in has to be at a, at such a high level, because you owe that to, to the game to your employee, to your group of players, to your group of staff. And so I walked away, because I knew that I couldn't give them the maximum 100% that they deserved. And it's as simple as that. And people thought that, you know, maybe aren't as going through a difficult time and something's not right. Well, no, I just knew that I had nothing more to give. I was on Mtn. And when I did resign, I spent time in Croatia and, and honestly, I had never slept better, I'd never eaten better, I actually started craving again, so go into the gym playing fiber side soccer, and that's part of it too. Because, you know, when you're in coaching, there's no set time for lunch or dinner, you know, you're often skipping meals, you've got the laptop out, you're you're not around family, you need, I needed a bit of it millage time, I needed to put myself first and, and even the simple things like having the chance to be around for birthdays or walking my daughter to school, that that was all part of, of my decision to be honest. So that's where the the the empty statement came, because that's what I honestly felt. And maybe I was too honest. But that's, that's how I am. That's how I coach. That's how I deal with my players, and staff. And I always feel that that's how you have to be and whether or not people like it, or they don't they have to always say, you know, you might not accept my decision, but you've got to respect that. And that's how I thought at the time and yeah, look, I've now been out of the game for 18 months, but at the time, that's that's actually how I honestly felt
Paul Barnett 37:19
he may have been out of the game, but you're over there in Croatia and it's a very proud sporting nation. I mean, just people listening are not aware it's 4 million people. But when you look at water, polo, handball, football and basketball, they're in the top, you know, the top echelon in the world. And I'm wondering what you've learned, from watching the coaches over there that is going to find its way into your own style when you get back into it.
ante Milicic 37:52
I think looking over here, it's, it's different. And a lot of people asked me that, like, you know, how is Croatia so successful at so many different sports for such a small population, it just shows me that there's multiple ways to be successful. Croatia have got ordinary training facilities, their their coaches really have to improvise a lot in the in the situation and, and what they have, but when I look, why are they so successful, I put it down to probably a couple of things, and in every different country with this culture, and it's mentality is different. So you look at Croatia, and I think, you know, with with the kids upbringing, this there's a strong mentality to succeed in, in sport, they are, they are such Mentally strong people. And that obviously has a lot to do as well with, you know, what the country has been through. They're very strong, gifted genetically as well. And, and that definitely, particularly modern sport plays, plays a huge part, their national teams are very, very patriotic. And I always used to find that interesting when I was working in international football, you know, tournaments, how teams would sing their national anthems are still feel that there's something in that so, you know, you won't see something here in Croatia and all or take it to Australia, for example, because we've got better weather better facilities with a better infrastructure, we've got better funding where you know what we're actually in some ways more professional with the way we do our, you know, analysis, our spare rehab, our medical, everything but Croatia has a system that works for them. And, you know, they do It won't change. It's the same as when I played here. And now that I'm living here, their system works for them. I think you need to find as a coach, what works for you. But Croatia, definitely for the amount of, of people that it has. They are so you know, overset overachieving because that's again, their mentality, they expect to to win that day, don't don't play Brazil and think they're underdogs. They're so strong mentally and believe and have that confidence that it's, it's actually a pleasure to watch.
Paul Barnett 40:41
And say, you've been very generous with your time. So maybe just one last question, if I could, I know that you're not potentially not finished with your coaching career there, maybe we were talking before, there may be another gig somewhere along the line, somewhere a bit more sunny, perhaps. But when you reflect on the long arc of your career so far, what is it that you hope is the legacy of left with the people that you've worked with?
ante Milicic 41:08
The people that are work with, so we touched on a bit like when you take over a theme, or I'd like to think that when, when people come into an organization or a team that I've worked in, that they, they see that there's good, you know, processes, you know, in a good culture that have been in place here, and I think that's so in order and that, you know, your your players and and staff, I think along our coaching journey, they'll they'll work with so many different coaches of all different levels and from different backgrounds, but if they can, can see, you know, the genuine work that you put into improving everyone in the organization I think, you know, that's, that's for me, what, what means the most,
Paul Barnett 42:09
and a, it's been terrific chatting with you today. I have thoroughly enjoyed learning a little bit about your history, particularly given the Matilda craze that's been going on, if not in Australia, definitely in my house with my two daughters, but I wish you all the best for Christmas over there in Croatia and for whatever comes next in your coaching career. Thank
ante Milicic 42:29
you, Paula. I really appreciate the time the chat and you know, wishing everyone all the best