Becky Burleigh Edit
Fri, Nov 25, 2022 1:28PM • 25:54
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
coach, people, team, becky, winning, player, feel, drives, person, burnout, quote, talk, florida, question, important, game, big, personally, learn, world
SPEAKERS
Paul Barnett, Becky Burleigh
Paul Barnett 00:00
Becky burly Good afternoon, my time. Good morning, your time and welcome to the Great coach's Podcast. I'm so excited to be here. I'm thrilled to be talking to you. Last thing on a Friday before the weekend starts. Becky. Perfect. Can I ask you something really simple to kick us off? Where are you in the world? And what have you been doing so far today? Oh,
Becky Burleigh 00:21
well, where I am in the world is Gainesville, Florida, which is where the University of Florida is. And this morning, I got up, had a great cup of coffee, took my dogs for a walk and came to my office.
Paul Barnett 00:32
Right? We've got you fresh from walking the dogs. That's great. You'll have lots of energy to talk to us all things coaching, but also about the amazing what drives winning website and conference that you've set up. So we're going to get into all of that today. Becky, can I start by name checking some of the great coaches that you've that I've been able to find that you've had experience with Joe Pereira, Brenda Frese, who we've interviewed on the show, Clive Charles, Anson Durant, Billy Donovan, and then there are so many great coaches that have been filmed on on YouTube with your what drives winning conferences. So I'm wondering, from this up close and personal experience that you've had, what do you think the great coaches do differently, that sets them apart?
Becky Burleigh 01:14
We start off with the hard hitters. I love it, I will tell you this, having an opportunity to work through what drives winning and getting to, like you said, kind of see some of these coaches up close and personal that is like a PhD that you can't buy. It's been amazing. And I think it's really helped me when I was still coaching to try and take some of their best practices. But I really feel like the best ones, they understand that the people are more important than the tactics. And I think that everyone understands like having a strong process, there's no question. You can even argue that that's not important. But I think when you peel back the layers, what usually occurs for success or breakdowns is the human related issues.[PB1] [PB2]
Paul Barnett 02:01
Well, I want to you just mentioned that, you know, coaching anymore, I know you've just retired, but I have this theory that great coaches never really stopped coaching. So I'd like to go all the way back to your start actually, with the Gators at the University of Florida you got there in 94. And in 98, the team win the NCAA title. Now, when other coaches talk to you about setting up new teams beginning from scratch. What advice do you tell them?
Becky Burleigh 02:28
First of all, I would say there's some luck involved. And I definitely had that we had a few just really fortuitous things that happened that brought some great players our way. But I think the biggest thing I would say is don't put a ceiling on yourself. Don't limit yourself don't think, Well, I'm a new program. So I can't achieve XY and Z. I think it's you never know where things can go. And you never know when those breaks are going to occur. It could happen at the beginning of your career, the middle of your career and your career. Never. But I think not putting a ceiling on yourself is really helpful.[PB3]
Paul Barnett 02:59
Is that something that you've actually done in your career? Put a ceiling on yourself?
Becky Burleigh 03:04
No, I think I was just so naive as a young coach that I didn't like when I was coaching before Florida. I was a head coach at Berry College. And I was 21. And honestly, I just didn't know any better. I mean, I was recruits that were looking at North Carolina and Stanford and some of these big programs, just because I didn't know I wasn't supposed to be recruiting those kids at Berry College. And then I think when I got to Florida, I just felt like my first thought was, man, this is awesome. I'm at Florida. And then my second thought was like, I'm at Florida, like I have to really step it up. Sometimes we limit ourselves. And I think because I was so young, I probably didn't have that filter to do that.
Paul Barnett 03:43
Vicki, I've heard you talk on multiple occasions and in written articles about and this is your words, actually immense value that can come from conflict. And I'm really curious to ask you why do you believe this?
Becky Burleigh 03:58
Well, in my experience, I think over the course of years and years of coaching, I think some of the best relationships I have are with some of the people who had the most conflict on our team. And I think probably that's because we're having to have some hard conversations, I think probably it's because we're kind of having to get into vulnerable spaces, which definitely accelerates your relationship.[PB4] [PB5]
Paul Barnett 04:19
What about an example of where you've managed your way through conflict well, and then come out the better side with a better relationship and or performance?
Becky Burleigh 04:30
Well, I can remember specifically, there was an example of a player that was really frustrated, she was a rising senior, and her role was sort of declining on our team and, and she came in and she was just, you know, livid, she was just sort of unloading all of that anxiety onto me. And you could easily take that very personally as a coach, and that could probably damage your relationship if you took that personally. But I tried to think about like, man, if I'm in her shoes, and I'm a rising senior, and I see my role declining, and that's going gonna be really tough to swallow? Like, how can I see it from her point of view and ironic I'm gonna, this is not planned, always on my desk, every job I've ever had, I keep a little thing of Q tips. And the reason I do that is because I feel like it just as a good reminder for me quit taking it personally. So I've always had that I have it here on my desk right now. And it's just, I think that compartmentalization for me, probably helped create some longevity in my career, but most importantly, preserve some relationships that if I had taken things personally, I might not have been able to overcome.
Paul Barnett 05:38
Now, can it be taught not to take things personally?
Becky Burleigh 05:42
I think so. I mean, I think it's just reframing it and seeing it from a different point of view. Because I think when we take things personally, we just see it from our point of view, like, we're like, man, what she's saying is hurting my feelings, instead of like, what she's saying is coming from her place of hurt, and how do I help her and partner with her to solve that?[PB6]
Paul Barnett 06:02
What's an interesting idea? Was there a moment or so it sounds like it's a well developed philosophy for you? How did you build up to it?
Becky Burleigh 06:11
That's a really good question. I think I have found myself in the middle my whole life, I have two brothers. So you know, you're always going to be in the middle of that. Even in other situations with friends and family. I just feel like I've always been sort of this mediator person, for some reason. Maybe that's the part of it that helped me was always being able to see both sides. I am a Libra, who are so balanced.
Paul Barnett 06:34
Vicki, I have another quote here from you. And it quite intrigued me, actually. And I'll read you the quote, and I'll explain why it intrigued me you say? I think burnout is when we stop wanting to learn. Now, what fascinated me about it is many people listening right now are leading teams, community work, business, sport, whatever, where people are experiencing unprecedented levels of burnout. You know, it's part of leading to the what Bloomberg has called the Great resignation. And I'm just really wondering, is it possible to ignite a desire to learn and people to then help ward off burnout?
Becky Burleigh 07:11
Well, I think some of that burnout, and the inability to want to learn more is to do with bandwidth. And I feel like we are so busy, we fill time with so many things. And so maybe part of it is creating space for learning. But also having something compelling to learn, I think is important. And I think when it comes to businesses and things like that, it's like, what are you willing to give to people, that could be something that they're interested in. And I think so often, especially if I'm the boss, maybe I give tasks to my people underneath me that are things I don't want to do, instead of trying to sit down, align self interest with them, and figure out what their interests are, and maybe share some tasks that they have some interest in, because now that could stimulate the desire to grow a little bit.[PB7]
Paul Barnett 08:03
Talk about bandwidth. And yet, you've been very successful at managing a coaching career or a media career or definitely a business that's growing and is definitely internationally recognized, particularly in the coaching space. How do you manage your bandwidth?
Becky Burleigh 08:19
That's a really good question. I Well, first, I think that I was blessed with a strong capacity to work. I mean, even when I was in college, I played two sports, I held, I think three or four jobs at the same time. And so I think I'm a good manager of my time. But I also think it goes back to a little bit more of like the compartmentalization part. I don't carry work home, maybe I do sometimes. But I think as a whole, I think I do a pretty good job with that. I don't need a lot to refresh, I kind of know what I need to refresh it. I don't need much. But I do need some. And I recognize when I need it. And when I need it, I take it. That might be something as simple as taking the dogs for a walk. But it also might be just going to see a concert or something that checks me out of whatever my day to day stress is. And I think so many of us feel like, okay, well, we have so much to do, we can't take that time. And the way I've always looked at that is if I don't bring my best energy to my team, like there's nothing more valuable. There's no task that needs to get done that's more valuable than me bringing my best energy to my team. And so I I've found a way to, I guess, wrap that around in my mind that if that means me getting fresher is going to be better for my team. And it means I don't get to do a task. I have no issue with that whatsoever.[PB8] [PB9]
Paul Barnett 09:38
Becky, there's a lot of talk lately about people use the word mental health. I'm not sure whether it's the right term or not. I'm not an expert, but they use mental health to describe the struggle they have with the anxiety that goes along with being a coach. And I'm wondering how you engage with this topic and how you talk to people about it.
Becky Burleigh 10:00
I think it is definitely like a wellness issue, especially in coaches because it is so high stress so visible, so wins and loss oriented. And it's not to say that there aren't other careers that have that if someone loses a big sale on Wall Street, it's not going across the ticker on ESPN, that visibility, I think adds to all of it. To me, it's like, okay, if I'm going to spend a lot of time in my office, let's say, Well, I'm going to make my office a place where I want to spend time. So I'm going to decorate my office, the way I want to, I'm going to surround myself with is to as much as I can with my own abilities with people that I want to be with, so that when I'm at work, I'm not dreading it, I'm actually looking forward to going to work and I'm enjoying it. And I think so many people, it's like, oh, off to work today. I don't think I've ever felt that in my life. I get excited to go to work. I've worked with great people. And I've found ways within work to have fun, even if it's just a two minute conversation down the hall. That's a refresher for me, as opposed to needing to take a sabbatical. Like I think I can do it in little doses.
Paul Barnett 11:04
Well, funds important to you, but so is courage, because you talk about it as being one of the team's key values. And I'm wondering, why is it so important to you as a value?
Becky Burleigh 11:15
I think it goes back to my history as a coach, when I was 21, as a head coach, you're just kind of like, what the heck. And then when you get to Florida, and you're a young coach, and you see all this success around you. I mean, it kind of takes courage to put yourself out there. And I think with us, like at Florida, for example, we talked about winning the national championship in four years. But what you're not talking about is the four years before that, we were getting our ass kicked, like we would play North Carolina every year. And I mean, I remember the first time we played when we lost nine nothing. And I think they just were told to stop scoring, like could have been worse. So like, but so many people, like if that happens, so you get this nine zero score, and they're like, oh, geez, I'm not gonna do that, again, we just went out it again. And again. And again. And like every single time, we started to close the gap, but you have to be willing to put yourself out there. And that, to me is where the courage comes in.
Paul Barnett 12:09
The other thing that you've done, which I wanted to ask you about is the alumni weekends for your ex players, so they can come along and meet the latest team. I know we got one coming up. Well, you probably got a couple of 100 people coming. I imagine.
Becky Burleigh 12:21
It's just so fun. I mean, to me, one of the most rewarding parts of being a coach is just seeing everyone go through the course of their life. And I tell some of our players, I'm like, Man, I hope you have kids just like you. I think they know what I mean when I'm saying that. But it's just such a fun thing to see people go through the different stages of our lives, but still be connected back to something and my college team that I played on, we are really connected. We meet every year, sometimes twice a year. And it is like my inner circle. And I would wish that for everyone because to have for me like a strong group of women that I can rely on for anything at any time. I don't know you can't buy that. I don't know how you find out if you don't already have it.[PB10]
Paul Barnett 13:05
Or I wanted to ask you a slightly different question. Because I imagine it's a great school, the people in your program are probably driven, ambitious, they leave the program, and they joined the real world, inverted commas. I'm wondering how you've seen them use their drive and ambition positively and not let it get the better of them when they get into sort of these everyday situations.
Becky Burleigh 13:30
I think the thing about being on a team that people take for granted, if you're on a team your whole life, you just like that's the water you live in. And you don't even know some of the skills that you've learned from doing that. But then when you go into the real world, and you're interacting with people who haven't been on a team, you're kind of like, what was happening here? Like, why is people not sharing stuff? Or why are you not like, why is there not more camaraderie here or things like that. And so I do think that's something to learn that people may not have had the same experience you've had. But I also think it's an opportunity to bring some of that team's ship into those environments. And I think in terms of like the competitiveness, I have learned that I played it like a de league tennis group. And these are people who are they weren't college athletes or anything like that. And it wasn't like competitive to win over the top. But like celebrating like good shots and stuff, people will be looking at me like what is wrong with her? I'm like, do we seriously not celebrate big shots? So like, I do think you've got to have to read the room a little bit, but at the same time, like, take what's valuable in that team environment and bring it to those places that might not have experienced it yet.
Paul Barnett 14:41
Well, as much as you're in team and you do talk about it a lot. You also talk about the idea of person over the player. It's probably the most quoted phrase I found when I was preparing for today. So why is the person over the player so important to you?
Becky Burleigh 14:59
Well, that's star Did with a player that we had here that had a lot of pressure on her because not only was she a big recruit coming in, but her first weekend, she scored five goals in two games. And so the expectations just went through the roof from there. And she had a lot of challenges in dealing with those. And the best way, you know, my business partner at that, still, Brett lead better with one tries winning, he worked with her. And she was the one who sort of came up with this concept of I want people to watch me and see the person more so than the player. And it's like a great opportunity for her to like, if she has success, terrific, she can respond to success as a person, if she has adversity, they get to see how she responds to adversity as a person. But either way, they get to see her and not just what happens on the field. Bill bezeq, who's a sports psychologist from the UK, a really big contributor to what drives winning love him, he talks about it in the terms of human beings versus human doings. And I feel like sometimes athletics can become a very transactional space, you can feel like there's disposable coaches, disposable athletes, and again, I'm sure this transfers into the business world too. How do you make people feel more valued than just for what they bring on the field or what they bring into your business?
Paul Barnett 16:20
I mean, it's definitely definitely transfers into definitely a corporate environment where you're dealing in a transactional space, particularly in markets where people change jobs regularly. And there's parts of Europe with that's definitely the case. But is there something that you can do very simply and quickly to help people feel more valued?
Becky Burleigh 16:38
Well, I got really good advice from a friend of mine, who's now an NBA coach. And he said to me, we had a big team, when you're really big team, like, it's very hard to keep that size team happy. At the beginning of the year, he said, Well, if people choose to leave at the end of the year, because they want to have more opportunity, they want to get more playing time, things like that, then that's okay, like, just help them find the right place for them. But if people leave at the end of the year, because they feel like you didn't invest in them, then that's on you. And that's shouldn't happen. And so what I would do in that particular year, and kind of carried it over even beyond was like, if there was somebody on my team that maybe wasn't getting the rewards, which in our world is like playing time, I would say to them in our individual meetings. So in what ways can I invest in you, besides playing time? In what ways can I invest in you that I'm not already doing. And I think they at least, they knew that I was concerned about them. And when we did have probably four or five kids leave at the end of that year, because of lack of opportunity. All of them, we helped find their new place. All of them felt like it wasn't a bad experience, because we had their best interest at heart, maybe it just wasn't the right fit in terms of what they wanted to get out of the experience and what we wanted to get out of the experience.[PB11]
Paul Barnett 17:53
Becky, in an interview last year, you were talking about a friend who's got a 10 year old daughter, and you this person, I can't remember the gender of the child, but they were going for a trial that was coming up. And they were talking to you about it. And you said, I'm gonna give you some advice. Just focus on energy fund and collaboration. And I sort of circled it. And then later on, I read, where when you talk to your team, you say, we need to you talk to him about the importance of striving together when it comes to competitors. And I just sort of thought there's this theme that sort of sneaks its way through a lot of your story, and it's around selflessness, you know, doing something for others. I think it even has driven the what drives winning conference to initially put together to share knowledge and help others. Where did this come from?
Becky Burleigh 18:37
I think I really learned some big lessons as a player, when not when I was a freshman in college, I was really judgmental towards my teammates, I felt like I was a very committed person on my team. And there were people on my team who I would say were not as committed as I was. And I wasn't very interested in getting them to be more committed, I was just really more interested in pointing out the fact that they weren't committed. And obviously, that's not a very good teammate. I think I learned quickly that judgment was not the solution. And the solution was more somewhere in the gray. I was very black and white as a younger person. And then coaching men. Boy, you can't really live in the black and white as a coach. So I think that helped me understand that whole concept a little bit more. [PB12] [PB13]
And to be fair, from a strive together process. It's like that is also a way to make you better. So it's not just about unicorns and rainbows and let's hold hands and sing songs. It is Iron sharpens sharpens iron. We talked about that all the time as far as like, how do you bring out the best in each other? And you don't do that by going half assed against one another. You do that by pushing each other as much as possible. The question comes into how do you react to the playing time situation which as a coach, that's the hard part like I am always offering judgment every time I make a starting lineup. Every time I make a travel squat, that's a judgment. It's an opinion. And that's what I try to tell people. It's a, it's an opinion. And it might not be an opinion you agree with. But it shouldn't define you, because it's one person making a judgement. And so how you react to those situations, I think is where you really see someone's true character.
Paul Barnett 20:18
Becky, coaches can't see the world in black and white. Can leaders in the community see it in black and white?
Becky Burleigh 20:25
Now, in my experience, I don't know maybe it works for some people. And sometimes I kind of wish I was a little more black and white. But I just feel like empathy is a really important skill for me too. And so you can't let empathy cloud your decision making because that you can take that too far. But I think you can't ignore it. Because if you ignore it, then there's part of you that's like, I don't know. For me personally, I feel like that moves me to just transactional.[PB14]
Paul Barnett 20:54
I read another quote of yours that caught my eye. In fact, I don't know whether it's your quote, but you use it a bit. Get curious, not furious.
Becky Burleigh 21:02
I did steal that from someone, I really need to figure out who it is because a lot of people ask me about
Paul Barnett 21:07
such a good quote. Are you such a good quote? Vicki, I used it today at work, I have to admit, so it's it's found its way to Romania. So thank you very much for that. But I know why it resonates with me. But why does it resonate with you so much,
Becky Burleigh 21:20
okay, if you've spent your life working with 18 to 22 year olds, they're going to do stupid things a lot. And so being able, being able to not get emotional about those stupid things, even if they happen at two o'clock in the morning, even if they happen at a downtown bar, whatever the circumstance is, like, I think it's more just like, Okay, let's talk about the why behind that. And let's deal with that. I mean, I used to always tell our players all the time, like you can call me anytime in the night, it doesn't matter. First of all, I'm pretty good. Like, when I when you wake me up, I'm gonna sound like I've been awake for hours, which I have. But we're not going to get crazy about the situation. At that point, we're just going to deal with what's at hand, whatever the situation is, we're going to deal with that at hand. And maybe a day or two days later, whenever we can get some resolution, we'll talk about all the consequences that have occurred. But in that moment, I just don't find that there's too much helpfulness in getting emotional about it.[PB15]
Paul Barnett 22:18
emotional control, something we all want to get better at. Is it possible to learn?
Becky Burleigh 22:23
Totally, I think that's just a mindfulness thing. It's like even in a game. And so this is this is not like necessarily like out word emotion. But like, I try to think of myself when I watch a game. So this is going to sound a little weird, but I think about it, not just like looking through my eyes watching the game, because when I do that, I can totally take the ride of the waves of whatever's happening in the game. If I look, a view of me behind myself watching the game, there's just enough separation there for me to be very engaged, but also enough separation to be like, Okay, what does the team need for me in this moment, as opposed to what do my emotions feel? Because sometimes those are very different things. You do that every game, I try to I can find myself going into seeing the game through my eyes. But then I just try to remind myself Alright, step back, step back. And the step back for me means like me watching me watch the game.[PB16] [PB17]
Paul Barnett 23:21
Fascinating. Vicki, I'd like to finish with one final quote. And one final question. It's a really good quote, I'd like to read it to you, you say, I see my role as a coach, as someone who helps the players separate their identity as a player from their identity as a person and utilize their sport for personal growth, all the while aggressively pursuing excellence. It's so powerful. And you've talked about, you've talked about the essence of this quote through the interview. But now that your time at Florida has come to an end, I don't think you've finished coaching. But you've definitely come to an end at Florida. What do you hope is the legacy that you've left there so far?
Becky Burleigh 23:59
Well, hopefully, there's there's way more ways to promote legacy that aren't just coaching. And I think there are obviously you're doing that right now with what the work you're doing. If we can all remind ourselves of who are we becoming in whatever we're doing, whether it's parenting, whether it's coaching, whether it's business, because we have that opportunity every single day. And Jim Lehrer, who also has worked extensively with what drives winning, he has this quote, who you are becoming as a result of the chase is the most important thing. I've kind of shortened it, I actually have it hanging in my office, and I have it it's right here Who who are you becoming as a result of the chase? To me? That is a question that if we can all ask ourselves that on a pretty regular basis, we're going to know if we're headed in the right direction, because I think we all innately know when we're doing things for our own self interest, or if we're doing things for the greater good, and that greater good can coincide with our own self interest. That's when you hit the sweet spot, but like find ways To become a better person as you pursue things, you almost like that separation of the identity for me, it frees me up to be even more of a competitor even more of a hard worker because I am not so shackled by the outcome. And if I take away the fear of the outcome, then I can put myself more fully into what I'm doing. But I think that's hard. I think that takes some practice. But I think you can ask that question about yourself in terms of who are you becoming as a result of the chase on a regular basis.[PB18]
Paul Barnett 25:31
Becky Bailey, what a great interview to finish a long week here in Romania. got tremendous energy. You've pumped me up for the weekend. And for that, I thank you so much.
Becky Burleigh 25:42
Well, you had great questions. They were awesome. I mean, they got me thinking this morning. got me ready for the rest of my day.
Paul Barnett 25:48
Thank you, Vicki. I can't wait to share this with a broader audience.
Becky Burleigh 25:52
Thank you.