Brenda Brown Edit
Mon, 10/11 1:42PM • 36:01
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
coach, people, year, players, pressure, talk, paul, captain, head coach, staff, responsibilities, kids, practice, brenda, student athletes, learned, situation, communicate, blacksburg, academics
SPEAKERS
Paul Barnett
Paul Barnett 00:00
Randy, welcome to the Great coach's podcast.
00:03
Thank you, Paul. It's great to be here. I'm very honored that you would ask me to contribute.
Paul Barnett 00:07
We are very excited to talk to you today I'm a big basketball fan. I'd like to start with something really simple though, if you could just tell us where you are in the world and what you've been up to today.
00:16
Awesome. I am in Blacksburg, Virginia. Most people know Blacksburg because this is where Virginia Tech is located. And my husband, Jeremy and I moved here about three months ago, so he could begin pursuing a Ph. D program in engineering education, I am now working for a Moving and Storage company. So quite a different industry than what I was doing six months ago. But that's where I landed here in Blacksburg. And so we're excited about the future, and just really enjoying the process and how it's both challenged us enlightened us, for sure. But that is what I'm doing currently.
Paul Barnett 00:52
Well, we are very thankful for your time today. And we're going to take you back to UNC where you just finished up coaching and we'll take you on a bit of a tour of your successes there. And but you might even go back further to high school. That's okay with you now. So I'd like to just start by winding the clock a bit, actually, because you've had first hand experience of some great coaches, there's Amanda Butler, Angus, Baron, Otto and john best. And that's just the tip of the iceberg. But what is it you think the great coaches do differently? Well,
01:21
I think the great coaches are lifelong learners, you'll hear that a lot. But I think they're evaluating themselves constantly and pursuing their craft constantly. And our craft is pretty broad in terms of coaching, you've got your technical piece, and in basketball, people say X's and O's. And then you've also got your delivery piece, how you're connecting to your athletes and individualizing, that coaching to get the most out of them. And so you've got to know yourself. And also you've got to know your audience at any given time.[PB1] I mean, there's a way you communicate effectively to a group of 18 to 22 year olds, and to your staff and to boosters and to recruits and their parents, and you don't lose your authenticity or your integrity. But you have to have that situational awareness and know what that group's needs are. I found Paul and and I didn't do this very well at the beginning of my career, but because you want to know everything you want to be right, and you want to have all the answers, but you have to be willing to say I don't know, I would also say you have to be willing to say I made a mistake. And here's where I could have done something differently in front of your kids in front of your staff, because they're constantly evaluating you and learning from you, and preparing perhaps themselves to be a head coach[PB2] .
And the last thing I would say, and this kind of goes to that audience is just be great communicators. So that's not just how we're speaking with people. I've learned that listening over the years and not necessarily listening to correct or respond, but truly listening to try to figure out where that person is coming from is truly important. [PB3] So that's the last thing I would say about that. And I'll give you a little nugget, something that prepared me to be a head coach. I was on three first year head coaching staffs. So at Georgia Tech, I was working with Michelle Joseph, I was there with her for a year. And I think she was at Georgia Tech for 16 years after that. And so I learned a lot from watching that experience and going through that. My very next job at Jacksonville University small division one school in the Atlantic Sun Conference was for Jill Dunn. And that was her first year as a head coach. So that was staff number two. And so I was there with her for a year. And then with Amanda Butler, at UNC Charlotte before she went on to Florida. And of course now she's at Clemson, but she was a first year head coach. And so that was just such a blessing. I mean, what an experience to be in the trenches with a coach that's doing it for the first time. I learned a lot about that and learned a lot about what they did mostly really good decisions they made. And of course, we all make mistakes. So I was learning from both angles. But I just want to look back at my coaching career, I think, wow, I don't know if I know anyone else that has been on a part of that many first year, head coaching staff. So that was really cool. And that really influenced my experience as well.
Paul Barnett 04:23
And yet, Brenda in your first year is coach, by your own admission, you said you're a little hot headed. And I'm wondering how did you learn it? And then what did you do afterwards to adjust your style?
04:35
I think that most people would describe me as intense. And it's that passion. We all want to succeed and we want it really badly. And I think that passion can sometimes interface with emotion. And I love passion. Emotion can really be difficult in a coaching situation, whether you're in practice, or responding to something since that coach comes in and says hey, we lost his recruiter. I made this mistake. And how do you respond to that? What is your first response to adversity? And mine wasn't great. I think it was really what was happening, Paul, I was seeing life through the lens of how my circumstances we weren't very good. And that first year, we had tons of injuries. It was a rebuilding process. But I was looking at it through the lens of how is this making me feel? How is this impacting me, instead of focusing on the external and how I can make my kids and my staff better? How I can get them through this journey? Because Paul, we were two and 2008. And those two wins were against non division one opponents. So we did not win a division one game in my first year of coaching. And so I found myself sometimes clicking my heels like Dorothy and the Wizard of Oz, I want to go home. It was tough fall, but also learned anger and emotion can become a distraction. And you always want to keep the main thing, the main thing. So I needed to adjust. And hopefully I did that to a degree.[PB4]
Paul Barnett 06:05
Well, you did adjust because it was a very successful tenure. And I want to step through that tenure. But you talked about the rebuild. And many coaches get into a situation like you were in. What did you do first? What sets you on the path to the success that came later?
06:21
I think that the first thing I did, that was a good decision. So I can pat myself on the back for I didn't make many good decisions in that first year. But a hired a really good staff, I would say and I have talked to some coaches who just took their first jobs this in this past year. And then obviously coach Brown, who was my assistant for eight years, knowing that I made a great decision in hiring her to be on staff, I think you have to hire people that are very different from you. competent, hard working, and hungry. I think that was probably the best decision I made in my first year was staffing.[PB5]
Paul Barnett 06:58
And then when you finished last year, the head of Director of Athletics, Janet Cohn said about you, all who follow our program. Now the Brenda is passionate about winning games, but even more so about developing champions and leaders in life. So what kind of coaching philosophy Have you got that has led your boss to lead with this wonderful statement? When you left
07:19
somebody people ask about coaching philosophy, I think mine's pretty simple. I think in any profession, in any industry, your philosophy has to be first connecting with your purpose of why you're there, you're there for a reason. And I fully believe that in any situation, why am I here? What am I supposed to learn? How am I supposed to impact and the second one's kind of humorous is don't be something your players have to overcome. I wanted to be, I wanted to be something that was a presence and an experience that my players appreciated and enjoyed and look forward to, I didn't want to have to be something that players are eight years remembering, gosh, you remember she was, she made me feel so anxious, I felt pressure every time I was in contact with this coach, or I felt like she neglected me and didn't really care about me, except as a basketball player. So those are just as some examples of what I did not want to be. And so I tried to behave in a way that would impact my players positively and be a blessing rather than a curse.[PB6]
Paul Barnett 08:28
What about behaviors and values? Anything that's fundamental to your style?
08:32
Yes, I think the integrity of your word is critical. The accountability piece that I spoke about earlier, that is a connecting, everybody understands whether they admitted or not, that we all have faults and flaws. That's just in our nature. And so the more we're able to communicate that the relatability I believe is got to be there. Of course, you're going to relate on different levels to different kids and different staff members at different times for different reasons. But I think both of those things have to be there. In terms of the non negotiables, honesty and straightforwardness. Your everyday living has to be there as a coach.[PB7]
Paul Barnett 09:10
I love this idea of Don't be something your place have to get over. It's a wonderful quote and it can be applied to any part of one's life breeding a bachelor can see that your mother was a big supporter of yours. And I'm wondering, is that something that came from her? And if not, are there other elements in your coaching style that you see reflected from her
09:29
moms or moms, so maybe they're just so supportive, they're kind of neat in that they believe no matter what that their son or daughter is in the right. They're the biggest fans. They're the biggest protectors I think that we do view men and I think men do need to be very protective presence fathers husbands, however you want to look at that. But also women are just fiercely fiercely protective of their children and I found that I was after practice. As you all go sit in the office, you in the coaching staff, you sit in the office, you got to talk about practice, and things can be positive, they can also be a little bit negative in that circle. That's okay. You're venting. And we tried not to complain too much about our kids, because I didn't see much merit in that. But you're in that little circle of trust. And you might think also, and so she just wasn't really present today, what's going on with her. But outside that circle, if someone in the greater community was saying something negative about one of my kids or staff members, I mean, I was fierce mama bear was like, now I can be critical of them, but you have no right to. And so I thought, where is this coming from? So that was probably something I learned from mom. And just the consistency. I mean, she shows up. And the last thing I will say is mother's been through a lot. And as mothers tend to sacrifice quite a bit and just her resiliency and ability to march forward despite her circumstances. So those are probably some things that I learned from mom and we have the same name. I don't know if you knew that. Paul, her name is Brenda. So one of the funny things around our program. And this actually started with Amanda Butler, she would call me Jr. and call my mother senior. So there was junior and senior. There's a little tidbit if you're wondering where I got my name that is and her maiden name, Paul was Mach. And so a lot of people wonder, where does this coach Mach come from. And that's where that comes from. So she named me Brenda Mach Kirkpatrick. And so that's where the coach Mach comes from.
Paul Barnett 11:29
I feel like I should start calling your coach mark. Now I'm sitting up more straighter in my chair, I don't know if you can see that. There's a wonderful quote from you, where you're reflecting on your journey. And you say, the more someone tells you something, and you believe it, the more you want to do it. So I wanted to ask, Is there a player or staff member, that you've been able to improve through sort of delivering those words again, and again, and again,
11:53
I do believe that to a certain degree, it's that self fulfilling prophecy. I didn't come up with that, right. I mean, that's been something that it's socio psychological phenomenon that's been around for a while, I mean, the more you internalize something, or hear it, whether you're saying it to yourself, or you're internalizing something, that someone is saying to you, you believe it, sometimes you have to guard against that. Because if you're constantly hearing negativity, you have to have a filter there. But we try to talk positively to our kids. And I do think there are they're certainly pointing to one person would be difficult. But sometimes I don't know if you've heard coaches say that coaches believe in their athletes more than their athletes believe in themselves. And so we want to constantly be building them up and use language that's positive. Now you don't want to blow smoke, as we say, you don't want to fluff up or flatter. Because people can see through flattery. They know when you're not telling the truth. And so this person has to be able to back that up in terms of their work ethic, and what they're bringing to the table not perfectly, but there has to be some substance there. [PB8]
But sometimes people just can be so critical of themselves. That's something that we talked about a lot is how we speak to our players matters. And we want to be truthful. But we also want to be uplifting and encouraging because people need that. I mean, we need that in this world. And you can see with we're sort of pervasively negative right now and critical, as I was talking about earlier, and I think people need to hear positivity truth, but truth and love and positivity and hope that all of my players would say, coach, Mark really believed in me, and that helped me believe in myself, and really reach my potential in a better way. I can't do it for them. But seeing someone believe in you, and depend on you, that's the other thing, Paul, you can believe in someone? But are you willing to put the ball in their hands in a critical situation? Do you really trust them? Do you back that belief up with your actions, and when they feel that wow, Coach marks depending on me, she believes in me, this is an extra piece of motivation, it's not going to be the motivation because it can't come from me. And conversely, what I would say, Paul is I would encourage players, if your coach is a little bit more negative, that's where you need to use that filter, and then understand, you've got to have that personal accountability. And that whole self fulfilling prophecy can work both ways. But hopefully my kids would say that my belief in them and my positive language and the way I've communicated influence them and help them become better players and better people.[PB9]
Paul Barnett 14:33
I actually think that your positivity and the way that you develop your team lead to them having such a good postseason record. I don't know ask that question just yet. I'd like to ask another one. This idea of positivity and resilience because you've also been vocal saying pressures good. And to have expectations is good. I'm wondering how have you really isolated resilient to something you want to build and then gone around making the plays just improving handling pressure because the next question I want to ask is it seemed to have worked given your postseason success. But firstly, the question on how did you get them ready to deal with pressure?
15:11
Well, when we first arrived at UNC Asheville, there was no pressure, there was no expectation. If we dwell there and we stay in that state, then that means we're not improving. One of the quotes and you've heard this one before it's from Billie Jean King is pressure is a privilege made comes only to those who earn it. So I talked about that with our kids, if you're feeling pressure, if you're in a situation where there is external pressure. Now I want to be specific on this, Paul, this is more the external pressure that comes from expectations from outside expectations, because we all can feel pressure, internally pressure where expectations we have of ourselves, but if you have external pressure, people are watching. And people have an expectation, that means your program is improving. And the stage is increasing, the platform is increasing. And so that's what Billie Jean King, I think I haven't had a conversation about this, I think she is implying that when you're on that stage at Wimbledon, or wherever you are, you're in the NBA Finals, you're in the championship game at the free throw line, people are watching, and this shot is for the championship, you've earned it. And that's a privilege. I've tried to get our players comfortable with that, hey, we want this, this is a good thing. Now you don't want to internalize that, because there's that balance that can also just get you off your focus of what you're trying to do. But to be in environments where others perceived who this is a high pressure situation. Wow, that's where we want to be.[PB10] And so we talked about that we want to be in a place where people care, people expect our program finishing the top three of the Big South every year, we talk about things instead of leaving big issues as elephants in the room, we want to address those things, I think you got to talk about pressure and how to metabolize it and what to do with it.
Paul Barnett 17:00
You one, two and 20 A at the end, you finish up a UNC and let's just go through the postseason success back the back, Big South Conference Tournament crowds, NC double a tournament births, four consecutive posts, season births and one Big South Conference regular season title. This is pretty big turnaround and great success. So it felt to me preparing for today and just reading about your story, that there was something about your team's ability to handle pressure and stress that just was different and set them apart. And I wanted to sort of drill into that a little bit more and say, was there anything you talked to them about? Or was there a routine or a drill or something that got that optimum level of tension in the postseason and just gave them the energy they need to go on with it?
17:46
I think I'm probably going to answer this how a lot of coaches would when you're preparing your team as best you can, in practice, put your team in pressure situations, as much as you can make drills. And this is my philosophy as much as you can introduce competition into their everyday routine, [PB11] because think about how much you're practicing versus how much you're playing. In basketball. It's ridiculous, maybe not in at the NBA level or Major League Baseball. But in college basketball, we're playing 29 games a year Paul, when I charted our practices last year, I always put the number of the practice at the top of the page, where it practice 100 at the end of the season, going into the conference tournament. And that's where the gold is. And so what you do in practice matters in terms of preparing your players to be consistent in high pressure situations. Going back to my last response, I think you have to talk about it. You have to talk about for example, in 2015 16 we were picked eighth we finished first. And we happened to be hosting the tournament that year. And so we went from no expectation no pressure in 1415 to 1516. One year later, all of a sudden we're hosting the tournament. We're supposed to win. What Where did that come from? What do we do with that? And I remember sitting in a circle in our practice, Jim just sitting there legs crossed. And I said okay, let's talk about this. This was before our first tournament game. It was the day we had a buy and we were getting ready to watch the eight nine opponent play and we finished up our practice and how are we really feeling right now? What are we thinking? Because I've also learned that some people are feelers, some of your kids are feeling some of your kids are thinking they don't externally process all the same. So you kind of have to speak to both of those audiences. How are you feeling because we want to know that and then Okay, you thinkers out there, not that feelers aren't thinkers don't mistake that but we all process differently and we talked about it. The last thing I'll say is don't change too much. There's a process and a consistency. You got to be able to dapt but there's some aspects that are methodical, you don't want to change up your routines, game to game, most people need to be able to rely on that consistency of process.[PB12] And 1516, probably out of all the years we were there, we were very processed focus, I think I'll take some of the blame of the latter years, the last four years I was the head coach, I probably could have focused on process instead of results as much as we did after we won that first championship. And I know that was a long answer. But I think that some coaches may have the philosophy as well, we don't really want to talk about that, because then they're gonna start thinking about it. I don't have that philosophy, I think you need to talk about it, communicate about it, see where everyone is, in most situations. Now that is might not always be team conversations. But I think you have to address things with your kids. Don't leave things to chance or hope. Because hope is just not a good strategy. And if I'm not addressing something with my team, I'm hoping hope that this is not too much for them, I don't really want to bring it up, because then they'll start thinking about it, and maybe they're gonna feel more pressure. Now, I don't think hope is a good strategy. I want to cover as many bases as I can
Paul Barnett 21:05
you were captain of your college team. And now you've been a successful coach. So I'd like to ask you, what do you look for when you're choosing captain?
21:13
Well, first of all, I've thought back many times in my experience at Wake Forest, and honestly, we were not very good. You can have a winning culture and culture is culture, there's successful cultures and winning culture. And a lot of people talk about that. But then there's also traditions that can go in the other direction. And with a program like Wake Forest, who has improved in the past decade, of course, but that had traditionally not had success, I had a great opportunity in that program, I was there five years, and I feel like I just missed it. And because I don't want to go rehash my failures as a captain or a player, and not taking advantage of every opportunity. But what that taught me is that I don't want my players to have regrets, like I have, as a student athlete, I really looking back, I could have done a better job. When I'm looking for a captain. I think that consistency and work ethic it has to be impeccable, she has to be what I would call and I say she she or he has to be your loudest worker, even if you're not focused on that kid, she's impacting the play. She's talking, she gets tips, she gets her hands on the ball, she's being physical, or if the play didn't really involve her, which in basketball, it usually involves, we only have five players on the court, but she's picking her teammate up or she's part of the positive response to a play. And the she is loud, so loud that you walk into the gym, you see that player, because she's working so hard, because people talk about work ethic, but there's a continuum, she has to be relatable, that goes back, I think your captain has to be a reflection of the coach in terms of their relatability and accountability, taking responsibility for her flock, that team that she's leading. And then I think the love for the team and her teammates. It goes so far, that she's willing to be inconvenienced, she's willing to take extra time after practice. She's willing to speak up and practice that is so hard for these student athletes to do that is so hard for them to address each other to correct, but you have to connect before you correct and his Captain has to be connected to her teammates or the respect won't be there. Although you could argue the work ethic again, she could earn the respect, but the way she communicates and the way she treats her teammates matters that she has to be willing to be inconvenienced. And I think a lot of kids want to be captain. And they do have a good work ethic, but they don't have time for the other responsibilities. It takes time to lead. And you have to be willing to give of yourself. And I believe you have to be willing to disappoint yourself. In other words, some people don't have that philosophy. If you have a choice between disappointing yourself and disappointing someone else, some people will say disappoint that other person and use you every time. And I think I understand what they're saying. But I actually think as a captain, you have to maybe not disappoint. Maybe that's a strong word. But you have to be able to sacrifice yourself for the good of the other person. And it's hard to have to do that every single day.[PB13] It's really difficult. And so that's something that we have conversations with our leaders about before they become captains. So it's a big responsibility. I think Captain ship on a team is huge. It should not be taken lightly and it should not be entered into lightly.
Paul Barnett 24:39
I can see by the detail where you answered that question just how much you've reflected on your experiences and captain and there's some really interesting ideas in there and something I would actually be quite afraid to do differently expectations. Because you're at university, you've got to go off and you've got to get good grades. You've got to finish you've got to be doing it And shapes, you've got all this pressure on you. And you've got to take on the captaincy. So I can see why you would really be looking for someone special to fill that role. But also, what was really good about your program, when you were coaches that that team was recognized by the NCAA Division One is having a top 25 academic performance. So you weren't just churning out really good basketball players who were winning championships you do, churning out people that were having a balanced life and hopefully going on and use their degrees to build a better life for themselves, too. So that must have been very satisfying for you as a coach,
25:33
it was Paul, I think that's probably our greatest achievement. And I really cannot take credit for that. Obviously, we emphasized academics, my staff did a stand up job in terms of really caring for their players and taking an interest in their academics, we had what we call a family structure. So we had smaller families within the bigger family. And we encouraged our players to take an interest in each other's academics, and ask and support. And I would point to, particularly at UNC Asheville, the academic environment there. It's a small school. The professors are very accessible and relational, their class sizes, again, are small. And so I think there was a combination of factors. One of the things though, I will say that our staff did a great job of was our APR for six straight years was 1000. And that's very difficult. And so just to kind of boil APR down academic progress rate, it's how are you retaining and graduating players? And I think in kind of this society of transactional, so what am I getting for you very results focused, if I'm not happy here, then I'm going to go shop elsewhere and transfer in athletics. I'm not saying all transfer situations are negative at all. So you know, sometimes when you talk about the transfer situation, that's a touchy subject, there are reasons and legitimate reasons that people do need to transfer. But we wanted to, when we made that investment in a young lady that we were recruiting, we wanted to retain them, I think, because we did that successfully for so long. It spoke to our academic attributed to our academic success at the institution and being in the top 10. I think that was in 2017. If I'm not mistaken, I can't remember which year we were in the top 10 of all division one teams and our cumulative GPA. That was probably one of the greatest achievements these girls had. Sometimes that doesn't get recognized, of course, as much as the athletic achievements. But I am incredibly proud of that. It's really, like you said, the kids have so many responsibilities. And to have a cube, we have 1415 girls on a team with those kinds of responsibilities at a rigorous academic institution. And our GPA is 3.5. That's pretty incredible. So I really have to say, hats off to the staff. And really, the credit is due to the kids who invested in that. I think that has to be part of your culture, if you want to be successful, because these kids, they are like you said, they're graduating, they're going and doing other things, and you want them to be prepared. And so investing in there, that's something to academic success. That's a very individual accountability in this kind of culture of group mentality. It's hard to do that with your academics, because nobody's taking the test for you. Nobody's writing the paper for you. Hopefully, that's a very individualized, very specific individual accountability, because I think there are situations where we cut to be individually accountable. And we're losing that, in my opinion, in our culture a little bit. We're losing the individual responsibility and accountability, we kind of group affiliate, and I don't know that that's a positive thing in all situations,
Paul Barnett 28:53
owner, just talk about your brand, you hand it over to she said, when she was taking on the role, she thanked you for empowering her over the prior eight years. I thought that was a very interesting word that she used. It's a great recognition, actually, of you developing your staff for the future as well. But I wanted to sort of twist the question a little bit and say, you know, what can be done to empower and encourage more women to get into coaching because there isn't a lot.
29:19
I think one thing we can do is we have so many platforms. Now with social media, a lot of the athletic departments, the sports, or the communication is within the athletic departments are putting out videos and material. Young ladies who are players or just the community has more access to what's going on within athletic programs today, far more than they did even five years ago. One thing I would say is communicate your passion for what you're doing. People want to do something that looks attractive, not easy. That looks like hey, we're having fun doing this. This is an awesome opportunity. And a privilege to be in a position of influence in a time where it is so needed. And we need more young women to be role models and to aspire to be role models for the generation that's coming behind them. But I think it has to look like we're having fun doing it. college athletics, I think one mistake we make is we take ourselves way too seriously. And I know there's a lot of money involved. And usually when there's money involved in any kind of institution, you have pressure that was influence decision making, which influenced his behaviors, and all of those sorts of things. And I think we've got to drill it down to now this is a game. And through this game, we can achieve so much. We can talk about relationships, we can talk about adversity, we can talk about team over the individual, we can talk about, wow, you're really going to be prepared for life after college[PB14] . Because of all of these responsibilities you had on your plate as a student athletes, you just think about so many, you're coaching, not just the athletic aspect of an individual, you are coaching the entire individual, people need to see people who look like them. Because there's a lot of conversation too. I mean, a lot of our student athletes, we have a very diverse group, and are we doing enough to encourage black females, especially in the sport of women's basketball to get into coaching, and so more of our student athletes will have role models who look like them. But especially regardless of race, just having more former student athletes who play the game. Getting into coaching is very important. And I think it's something we have to communicate about our responsibilities. And yes, there it is difficult, and it is demanding. But we have to also communicate, you can do it and still have a balanced life. [PB15] I hope that makes sense, Paul, what I'm saying because I think sometimes people think coaching at the division one level or any level is kind of an all or nothing, if I'm a coach of this is going to be 70 hours a week, and I'm not going to have time for these other things that I have desires for whether it be family or just having a more balanced life. And so I think people look at coaching, and they're like, Oh, I don't really know if I want to sacrifice these other things in order to be a college coach. And we have to demonstrate and communicate that you can have it all, it's going to be difficult, but you can have it all. And I think a lot of women may not want to get into coaching because of that. And I'm sure there's gonna be people on the other side of the coin that would say, athletic directors are hiring, maybe more males or something like that. But I think we've got to have more females in the applicant pool. Because what I found as a head coach, when I had a position open, I would have the ratio might have been two to one male applicants versus female applicants for positions. That was true. And every time I had a position open, and so that's where you got to think, okay, let's look at this. Why? Why are there so many more male applicants for positions in women's basketball than female applicants? So let me we could talk about this could be a whole podcast, kind of talking about that. It's critically important that we have females and coaching for both the coaches and the student athletes.
Paul Barnett 33:14
Brenda, one last question, if I can you having a sabbatical year, before you get back into coaching, maybe you're still working, so maybe it's not so much of a sabbatical year. But if we paused for a minute and looked back, you've been in basketball since high school, probably since you were a kid. And you've got some space now to think and reflect. And I'm wondering what you think the legacy is that you've left. So far as a coach,
33:36
I hope I've kind of spoken to this earlier about how I hope that our former players viewed me as a head coach, I would hope they would just simply remember me as someone who was ever present and showed up and rang the bell, I try to hang my hat on consistency, and love. I love not so much as the emotion I talked about with our players love being action. It's not just a feeling in any context, whether that be in your job, or in your marriage or in your relationships, that your actions speak louder than anything, I would hope they remember me as someone who cared was consistent and, and really loved them through word and deed.[PB16] And I don't know what the future holds. I mean, as I was telling you about before we started recording, when I resigned in April, I had no idea. It's not that I'm against making goals and having a plan, but I've also learned as a person of faith, I can have a plan but I have to be open handed about that plan. And plans can change. And so I'm excited about what the future holds. And I'm certainly not saying that I would not get back into coaching because it was such a wonderful experience. But I also have to be open handed with that. So we'll see but I love still being involved in conversation. And in relationship with other coaches and really have a passion for the game and for coaching because it really has changed my life. I really think it's a great profession. If I get back into it great if I don't, I'm always going to be a big fan of both players and coaches and the game and people like you. This is great. I mean, this whole concept of your why behind the podcast, I think is so cool. Because you have a daughter, and you're investing in her and what a blessing to have a dad invest in a little girl. I mean, that could be the biggest difference in her life. And I think this is very cool, what you're doing and I'm just honored to have spent some time with you today and I appreciate you having me on
Paul Barnett 35:39
the honor is ours. Coach Bach, thank you so much, Brenda. It's wonderful listening to your story. It's great reflecting on it with you and taking your learnings from along the way. And I wish you all the best in whatever comes along next.
35:50
Oh and best of luck with this and keep going keep doing it. Get as many coaches on here as you can and I will be definitely a lifelong listener of the great coaches podcast.
Paul Barnett 36:00
Thanks Brenda.