The Great Coaches Podcast Episode 020
Wed, 2/10 9:03AM • 38:14
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
coach, people, collingwood, female, afl, penny, players, premiership, williamstown, girls, conversations, question, play, bit, football, team, hear, story, year, sport
SPEAKERS
Jim Woolfrey, Paul Barnett, Transition, Olaf Lange
Paul Barnett 00:01
Welcome to the great coach's podcast. To me, being perfect is not about that scoreboard after
00:08
this is a chance you can understand the person and you can then work towards a common goal. We
00:16
are all on the same team. Now you do it to the best your ability to
00:20
focus on the fundamentals. We've gone over time and time again,
00:25
has got to be better.
00:26
We've known
Paul Barnett 00:28
great moments are born and great opportunity. My name is Paul Barnett, and you are listening to the great coach's Podcast, where we interview great sporting coaches to try and find ideas to help all of us lead our teams better. Our great coach on this episode is Penny cooler read. Penny is a former player who played for the Collingwood football club in the Australian rules football league women's competition. She also represented Australia in the international rules series against Ireland, as well as playing high level cricket. After retiring in 2017, she was appointed senior coach of the Collingwood football team for the 2018 season. In that year. She was voted Coach of the Year in the year after in 2019 led her team to a Premiership. She's also credited with changing the trajectory of female sport in Australia through winning a sex discrimination case that forbade girls from playing in mixed sex teams after the age of 12. Her action led to the rules being changed so that girls could continue playing until the age of 14, a documentary called even girls play footy was made about the case, and we have included a link in the show notes. Penny is both an inspirational coach in person. In this interview, you will hear her talk about pushing boundaries and challenging people's beliefs and expectations. She believes that anything is possible, and she shares stories from both her life and her athletes to illustrate this. One of the reasons Jim and I started this podcast was to have better conversations around the dinner table with our families. And when I shared Penny story, it inspired my own daughter to start an equality club at school to address some of the misconceptions the boys had around what girls were capable of an initiative that made me very proud. I hope Penny story resonates with you the same way it did with Gemini, the great coaches podcast and Nicola Reed. Good afternoon and welcome to the great coaches podcasts. How are you?
02:29
I'm fantastic. I think we're in week 26 of 417 stayed for lockdown here in Melbourne. But go go and really well. Thank you
Paul Barnett 02:39
all penny. I'm so sorry to hear that my parents are in Melbourne, and they're going through the same thing. But Could I ask it might be might be a bit of a bland question. But where in the world are you and what have you been up to today?
02:51
Today I have gone for my one hour walk. I'm in Melbourne myself. So going for the walk, took the dog got a coffee, sat down, watch some Netflix when I picked my partner up from work, she's a chiropractor, so she gets to continue working as an essential worker. Now just sitting down having a conversation with you. Well, we're
Paul Barnett 03:12
very happy you could carve out a bit of time for us your story, we talked a little affair about the impact your stories head on my youngest daughter. And I've really enjoyed discovering it as well. And I think everyone that's listening today is going to really appreciate the ups and downs of the story and the fact that it's unfinished and has a long way to go. But I'd like to start by just talking about the experiences you've had because you're very early in your coaching career. You've already had some great first hand experiences to some wonderful coaches. You were at Collingwood and I know Nathan Buckley would pop in from time to time, then now you're with Andy Collins at Williamstown. What do you think the great coaches do differently?
03:52
I think my experience with the Great's of Nathan Buckley and Andy Collins is how they build relationships with their players. And we see more often now how important that is to understand the person first and then the player second. [P1] [P2] And I think that's something that I do naturally is build relationships, I guess coming from my early childhood of being a bit of a rule breaker and I think I needed to make friends quite quickly so I can get them on my side. So I'm pretty good at making friends. But I definitely think that that's something that can separate the the good coaches to the great coaches, how you able to find the best out of your players by understanding how they operate, what makes them tick, and then also how to really see and adjust training sessions or your language or your body language to to make sure that you know that you care about them as a person. And at the end of the day, the results don't matter because you're there for them.[P3]
Paul Barnett 04:56
Gonna you transitioned into coaching very quickly. It was the it was the year After you retired, and in that first year you and Coach of the Year, and then in your second year you led the team to a Premiership, which is not normal not to have such a smooth and successful transition. But based on the success success, what what tips would you have for other players who are now transitioning into coaching?
05:18
I think the hardest thing for me when I was moving into my coaching is that I always knew that I wanted to coach before, before anyone realized that all I ever wanted to do was be the first coach of the Collingwood football club. Like for people who don't know you either love Collingwood or you hate Collingwood, and my blood is black and white. So I was born into a Collingwood family. And I don't really think I had a choice. My mom kept saying to me, that's my first word was magpie. And I do believe that that's true, wasn't mum or dad, it was magpie. And I still remember to this day, we have to do a school project when we were in grade two about Who do you want to be when you grow up, you know, my friends were doing, I want to be a vet, and I want to be a doctor, I want to fly helicopters. And here I am drawing a picture of this girl coaching Collingwood football club. And so I think that that's something that I always wanted to do was be a coach. And so when I, when I started playing football, it just sort of became something that I do naturally is help others being a leader of my club to also allowed me to pass on knowledge or encourage or to motivate people to get the best out of themselves. And I think that once I started playing for local and football club, I just saw, you know, this great facility and the support that these people gave players is that this is something that I wanted to do. And that was to coach. So as much as I like to say I retired, I think it was just my time to change careers, and really focused on on what I wanted to do as a person that was to coach and I think with any coach can understand that, you know, without having the the guidance of people around you, it's quite hard to know where to step and I have made some mistakes that I will continue to make mistakes as a coach. [P4] But yeah, the hardest thing for me from transitioning from player to coach was finding that line between being their teammate which I was previously in the previous season to now being there, the program leader, their coach, someone that I need to tell them what to do and how to do it. You've got Steph Chachi, who's I played football with for many, many years, I'm now telling her where to go on the football field and telling her how to get better. And I think for me, that was one of the hardest things is to know that they respected me enough to listen to me. And I think that once I learned that and once I truly believe that in myself that I am the program leader, I am the coach and they do respect to me. That's when I really started to step up and really enjoyed my coaching and not have the fear that they wouldn't listen to me.[P5]
Paul Barnett 08:01
You talked about God and sin there. Was there anyone or any group of people that helped you build that belief.
08:09
A lot of it was the ladies of the ifl w team. And I think it was also the title of coach at the time, Wayne sequin who took me under his wing and really showed me the way of how to communicate with people and especially with my peers. And I think it was also a guy named Brad gotch. So Brad gotch was the program director or the coaching director of the column football club. So you ever saw all the coaches within the club, which was the AFL the AFL, the AFL, w v, AFL w the netball team, the reserve netball team, and funnily enough, I used to play Junior boys football with his son. So I sort of we already sort of knew each other. So I think having some time and spending some time with him in the way that he also occurred to you. So coach Williamstown, so there's a like a three degrees of separation between myself and Brad gotcha, now that I'm at Williamstown, it just seems like it was all meant to be. And they really showed me that. It's you need to make mistakes, because that's the only way you're going to learn. And as much as you can lead a horse to water, it's up to them to drink it. So I remember this one time when Sigmund said to me that you know, Penny I don't think you should be going out and having coffee with the girls because that's you know their time and you're not a player anymore. And I didn't really listen to him. And yeah, went and had a coffee and a few things were said that I probably shouldn't have heard as as a coach and I think that that really cemented me to realize that there's a line between being a coach and being a teammate.[P6]
Paul Barnett 09:42
And that picture that you drew when you're a kid holding a Premiership cup of love, I assume wearing the Collingwood jumper. Is it still around?
09:52
You know, I've had many, many, many people ask me about it, and I lost my mum and we can't find it anywhere. But I can see see it clear his day. It was a picture of at the time, it was Stuart Lowe. And he had this massive, massive hands. And so I actually traced Stewart Lowe, put him in a Collingwood jumper and put a ponytail on. And instead of holding the football, it was a Premiership cup. And I can still see it very, very clearly in my head.
Paul Barnett 10:20
Penny when I was preparing for today, I've been gone for Melbourne for a long, long time. And I must admit, my knowledge of sport in Melbourne doesn't extend very far these days. But when I typed in your name, the internet, the first thing that comes up isn't your playing, or you're coaching. It's the details of the sex discrimination case that you fought and won with your friends and your mom for the right for girls to play, you know, continue playing mixed gender, Australian rules football up to the age of 14, the verdict? You know, I read read articles, I've seen a documentary The verdict, change the trajectory of female sport in Australia. And it's now featured in the National Sports magazine at the MCG. But that's not what I want to ask you about actually. Because when you're going through that case, I've got two daughters, 10 and 14. And I can only imagine some of the things that would have been said to you at the time. And I think I may be wrong, and maybe it was all positive, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't. Yeah, you're shaking your head. Okay, how did that experience of dealing with those negative comments shape you as a coach? Because I imagine it's given you a strong sense of resilience? That is part of what you're passing on to these players when you have these conversations in this intimate relationship with them.
11:35
Yeah, and you know what? It's a really, really good question. And one of the things that when I was sort of thinking about this question was someone and everyone's always going to tell you that you can't do something, or you're too short, you're too slow. You're not fast enough, you don't have the right body type, etc, etc. And for me, during that time, all I could think about was stuff you like, how do you know what I can't? Do? You have no idea what I'm capable of. And when everyone sort of said to me, I don't understand why you want to play footy one, because I bloody love it, too, because I'm pretty good at it. Three, it's because you said that I can't, that I want to do it. So I think having people continue to say, you know that this is something that you shouldn't be doing, or you can't do. I'm very much like, well watch me, I'll prove you wrong. And I think as a female football coach in the land of AFL, and in a what we would call the boys club, I will continue to push these boundaries and continue to show girls and females that there is a way if there's something that you want to do, don't let anyone tell you that you can't do it. And if they if you find yourself in a roadblock, find a way around it, threw it over it under it, whatever it might be, if there's something that you love, and something that you want to do, you will find a way to achieve that[P7] . And I think being so young at the age of 14, not only was I going through exams in school and having reporters chase me down the road and be on my school bus asking me questions about the court case, and people telling me when I'm getting my photo to look sad and look angry, and people telling you who I should be. I think that was when I realized that no one is going to tell me anything different. And I'm going to discover who I am and who I want to be on my own. And I don't need anyone to tell me other than I support you. And if there's something that you want to do, I'm going to be there and anyone that doesn't do that well and stuff. Yeah, you're not my friend,
Paul Barnett 13:39
Kenny. It's an amazing story. I'm going to put the links in the show notes. But the the actually the interview that I liked the most what I liked the documentary was good, but one that I really liked was the you and your mom went back and you chatted with the she's now a judge the QC that helped you. And what I liked about it was that you changed her life and for the better and then she's and she's now a judge and she's gone on and changing so many other lives that it's like this ripple effect from this one action that you took as a 1213 year old. That's a heavy burden to carry. So how you cope with that burden these days.
14:16
I tend to do weights quite a bit to make sure I'm still nice and strong to carry this around. No, no it's it's it's it's so funny because I haven't really had the chance to reflect on the events of 2003 when I was 1314 until I got the chance to sit down and spend a lot of time with myself during lockdown and COVID and it still amazes me that something so small while at the time I thought was so small and because I was so focused on just wanting to play football. How big of an impact this really had not just on Women and Girls wanting to play football but leadership in you know women in leadership. And gender equality and discrimination. And it's not until a couple of years on 15 or so years on that, it's really made me realize how big of a change that was. And what has come because of that, the evolution of AFL w more so women's sport in general and what it means to now have a pathway for girls to achieve and have the choice to choose whichever sport they want to play.[P8]
Paul Barnett 15:31
Now, that's great, I'm gonna actually move on for a penny, because there's so many other things to talk about, actually. And I'd like to jump into your coaching philosophy because I saw it, I saw a little interview with you where you said, having fun equates to playing good football. I mean, it's so true, of course. But you sometimes think at the elite level, fun gets left behind a little bit. So what are the other values that are central to your coaching philosophy?
15:57
I love this question. Because the more I get to talk about it, the more I feel like I can influence the next coach that wants to sort of take that leap into into that career. And I have three main values that I always fall back on. And the first one I have is to be engaging. And that's not just to my players, to my staff, to the people around me, but that's to the wider community to be able to have conversations with yourself and the media. And anyone that wants to have a conversation with me is to be really engaging, and to show that I'm genuinely interested in what they're saying, rather than being Oh, yeah, cool. No worries, I get what you mean. Yeah, I'm, you know, won a Premiership, I'm with Coach of the Year and, you know, now I'm at Williamstown, I don't really care about you. But for me to be engaging, that's part of the relationship building. And I think that I will continue to feel this way is that you can have a conversation with someone and change their life, just because you have that genuine care. So my number one is to be engaging. My number two is to encourage. So I want to be encouraging not again, not just to my staff to get the best out of themselves, not just to the people around me, but 100% to my players, I want to encourage them to reach their goals, I put a lot of emphasis on their own development. And I'm here as a coach to help guide help provide you with the tools to provide you with the education, but it's really up to you to get the best out of yourself. And I want to see you succeed. And that's by motivating encouraging him, pushing him to links that they don't think that they could make it making them believe in themselves. The last one is to empower and I think this is a maybe the last one, but it's probably the one that I hold closest to myself. And when I feel that things are getting a little bit tough, is to remember why I'm doing what I'm doing is that and that's to ultimately empower young girls and women to aspire to be more than what they think they can be. And I think having those three things continuously at the back of my mind, I have them on my whiteboard, I have him. You know, as you can say, in my locker at the Williamstown Football Club, is to always remember when things go south, that I'm here for a reason that's to engage, encourage and empower people around me[P9] . Can you
Paul Barnett 18:25
What do you enjoy most about being a coach?
18:28
I think seeing people succeed and seeing people reach their goals. In my first year of coaching. I had five girls drafted to the AFL w my second year I had another five girls drafted to the AFL W and knowing how hard that they've worked, knowing how much effort they put in the sacrifices. The discipline they've had to put themselves through that for me, makes me feel like I'm the real winner. I love the fact that I want to Premiership but that's not what I love the most about coaching. It's really seeing these girls succeed. And I'll share this story with you. We had this one girl. This is last year at the Collingwood football club. Her name was Morgan Doherty and she will probably if she ever hears this, I'm going to send this interview to her so she knows that she got to mention is that one of our first ever training sessions. In preseason, we went down to the Brighton Beach, and we're doing a beach session. And she could hardly hardly run. She hadn't really played a lot of sport or was coming off an injury. She really really struggled with the fitness stuff. And I remember her just falling over and something happened to her knee like her knee buckled or something. And she just started crying. I went over to her and said, Hey, man, what's wrong? And she was just in tears. And she was like, I can't do this anymore. I don't know why I'm here. I just, I just feel like I'm gonna let you down and you know, I'm not I'm not worthy of it. And I was like, Mike, don't you worry. Come on. We'll be right. We'll get you up. We'll get you fixed and we'll get you going. Anyway, and she ends up being in the Premiership team and I I think that her transition from where she was to where she is now, is another reason why I love coaching is because it's not so much about the destination, but being a part of their journey and seeing them succeed. And we had our one year anniversary on the 22nd of our Premiership. And she was like, I still can't believe this day. And I said to her, you deserve to be on that ground and wearing that metal. And her response to me was, it was all because of you. And that to me, took my job done. Coaching robot, I don't need to do anything else. And that's that's, that's a big reason why I want to Coach is to help these girls reach their goals, whatever it may be, whether it is to play one game player Premiership, to get drafted, to be a better kick than they were, when they entered the program. It's all about for me seeing these girls succeed and being a part of that journey.[P10]
Paul Barnett 20:54
Penny, it's a wonderful story. Thank you for sharing it. You do a lot of mentoring. You're pretty selfless with your time, too. I can see tons of articles and pictures of you dressing small groups of coaches and players. You know, when people come to you to ask questions, and you're in this mentoring role with them, so you have permission to give them advice, you know, you're not just they're asking questions to help them uncover? What are the key questions you're being asked time and time again.
21:22
I think the biggest thing from the majority of the coaches or the people that I've spoken to is, how do you build the confidence to be who you are? How do you find to be able to stand up in a room full of people and speak your mind? And I think for me, that's, that's the question that I asked myself a lot is How the hell do I do that all the time. And I feel that if you're confident in yourself, and you believe in yourself, it doesn't really matter what anybody else thinks is because you're, again, I'm probably really stubborn, is that no one's going to tell me anything. Otherwise, unless it's my mom. I think that's that's something that all young women struggle with. And that's all something that most people struggle with is the confidence to be able to believe in what what they're doing is right. But for me, I just love helping people. And I love football. And if I can bring those two loves together, then I think I'm doing a good job.
Paul Barnett 22:24
It's not just young people that struggle with confidence, too, I can tell you, there's a lot of adults. And I think that confidence is developed very early on in life. And if you miss out on developing it, I think you're playing catch up for a lot of your life. And so you need positive role models, like yourself to try and see what that behavior looks like. So I can understand why people would be asking you that question time and time again. But I'd like to flip around a bit, actually, because you've taken part in the Australian Institute of sports performance coach, and performance Leaders Program. And I'm really interested to see, you know, here what you learned there the things that really resonated with you.
23:00
Yeah, it's been a little struggle with the COVID happening. And basically, what was happening is we would go to the IRS for three days and do a three day program with the IRS group. And during COVID, we've had to sort of juggle that with online platforms and learning. So it's been a struggle. But from what I had been able to attend a couple of key things that I really learned, he's learning more about myself, and learning about who I am as a leader, what type of leader do I want to be, and then going through, I guess, steps to make myself a better leader, where I sort of am at the moment is, I feel like I've got a long way to go to be a more effective leader, I feel that my leadership skills are a bit of a novice at the moment, which is great, because I think everyone can learn more by reaching out and during programs, like the iOS program. And for me, it was more about the learning about the authentic leader of myself and learning about how other people lead. And how I found it really, really interesting to be in a room full of powerful, strong, independent female coaches, all living their dream of coaching the sport that they love and learning from them about how they deal with conflict, I think for me has been one thing that I'm not very good at is dealing with conflict and telling a player that we haven't selected them because for ABC D reasons. And for me, because I'm such a, I guess an emotional person is that I really feel for the player when I tell them that they're not selected. And that's something that I'm working on is again, finding that line between being a mate and saying, Hey, buddy, look, you just haven't done what we needed you to do this week. And that's why not playing or having learning strategies of how to have those conversations, I think, for me has been the biggest learning
Paul Barnett 25:08
any, I mean, you're not alone. Anyone who takes on a managerial role in the workplace, has to suddenly start directing and managing people they were peers with, I think finding that line is a very difficult thing to do. And it's not easy. And it's a question we ask on every one of these podcasts actually had, do you find that line about being too close to people but also being removed enough to be dispassionate and make decisions for the greater good of the team? It's, it's very difficult, but let's drill into conflict because teams, families groups, conflict derails them, especially when it's not resolved. So what's on your development? If we had a little look at your development plan, and I'm pretty sure you've got one seeing how organized you are? What have you got written there about developing your conflict management skills,
25:55
I think it's making it a clear line at the very start of the season and going through what the selection criteria will be, and who makes those decisions. And then also making sure that when I am having these conversations, prior to the conversations with the player is to speak to their line coach and say, This is the reason why I'm not we are not selecting Player A, we think that this is something that they need to work on. So one thing that always happened when I was playing and wasn't selected was I always got told, just keep doing what you're doing. You're going to you're going to you're going to get a game, just keep doing what you're doing. And like if I keep doing what I'm doing, I'm not going to get selected. So I was always very strong into making sure that when I was having these conversations with his players is to make sure that I gave them real direct, I guess skill or real direct information that they can actually go away with and work on not to say you're not selected because you didn't play enough game time or you're not selected because you didn't do your role or not selected because you haven't got X amount of possessions, and you should have got so really making sure I have a clear understanding of why they're not selected. The second one would be clear guidance into what they need to improve on, and making sure the people who they need to speak to know the reasons why so there's no Oh, yeah, but Penny said this, but you're saying that. And so I don't understand why I'm not being selected. So making sure there's a really clear and consistent voice.[P11]
Paul Barnett 27:27
Penny, I'd like to switch over actually and talk a little bit about women in coaching. Because the sad reality is, if you look at the Rio Olympics, 11% of all accredited coaches were female. And yet I was flicking through, we get the Harvard Business Review at work, you know. But there was an article a couple of weeks ago that said, you know, women outscored men in 17, of the 19 capabilities that differentiate excellent leaders from average or poor ones, which I didn't realize the gap was that big. I knew there was a gap. But I didn't realize it was that big. But my question is, what can be done to get more females into coaching?
28:07
This question is, is something that I'm really passionate about. And I think a lot of the time, females can feel like it's tokenism to have a female, a part of your coaching board or on the board of directors or in your organization. And for me, as a female, trying to be authentic in what she does, is that don't make us feel like we're there just for the sake of having us there. And I think that the more that females feel appreciated, and the more that females feel that they actually do belong as the program leader, as a board director, as a coach, that the more we're going to get involved, and being able to be flexible, as majority of the females are also the caregivers of their families, to have that balance between life and work. And that's something that I found has been quite difficult with being a female and not being able to provide full time opportunity as a as a football coach compared to my male counterpart who gets double or triple the amount of income for the same role. And now I understand that we're not at the same level as education or experience. But it's being able to provide females with the opportunity to have a full time role as a coach or as a leader without having to find other sources of income and to have the flexibility to understand that not all females are going to be able to be a full time physician but have the understanding that if they need to be the caregivers that they have that opportunity to do so. One thing I also think is to have more females in leadership and more female coaches be seen in the media and across social networks because you can't see we can't be what you can't see[P12] . And this is something What I've started to really understand is that before I became a football coach, there was no other female football coaches except for that God, Michelle, Carolyn in the AFL, W the first season. And then it was last year that Peterson was there and the female head football coach of the AFL, W. If there's not more people out there doing or being, then how can we expect other people to say that?
Paul Barnett 30:26
It's a great answer. And I think it's, it's very true. And it's a challenge, I think, for all people who are in leadership to think a little bit more about that not just have tokenism, but to bring visibility to actually the diversity of thought, appearance, gender, sexuality that is being present within the team. So I think people want to be part of group they want to look into a group and see themselves reflected back. And if they can do that, then I think participation within the group also increases. But I'd like to talk about your old school because in preparing for this, you know, when when I was researching there is an article actually pops up. And I didn't think it was a very good article, actually, because it says is the quote, Penny was a pioneer in helping to bring about the great opportunities for women that now exist in sport. And I thought the use of the word was was wrong, because it's not like you're in past tense, yet, you still got a lot, a lot of energy and a lot of runway ahead of you. So what are your longer term aspirations as a coach, where do you want to head to?
31:25
I mean, I'm really enjoying the journey at this stage. And I'm really enjoying learning more about coaching, and more. So who and how I want to coach what type of coach I want to be, but long term I think coaching the AFL W is is something that I want to do. But I also want to be able to push the boundaries in and coach, a male team, whether that be start off in the NAB League, which is the under a competition and sort of work my way through that process. Because I think that there's something really powerful about a female coach coaching and men's team or boys team. I think that's not just powerful for those coaches and those players, but also for young boys growing up, as well to see that it doesn't matter if there's a female coach, it just matters that there's a coach, and they're there for you. And I think that's just, again, a really powerful message is that it's not about the the gender or the or the sex or the race or religion. It's about that coach being the best person for the job.
Paul Barnett 32:29
And doesn't have to be Collingwood.
32:33
Look, wouldn't that be nice? I think ultimately, I'd love to go back home, as we would say. And I I've had many conversations with the one and only Eddie McGuire. And I'm sure when opportunity arises that that would love to have me back in a heartbeat.
Paul Barnett 32:50
Can you be very generous with the time today? And I'd like to ask one last question. And I think we've probably already answered it for this interview. But I'm gonna I'm gonna ask it anyway. You're very, very young in your career, you're still in your mid 30s, early, early 30s. I think I couldn't
33:05
Yeah, look at early 30s.
Paul Barnett 33:08
You've got years of coaching ahead of you. So asking a question about legacy doesn't feel right. So what I'm going to ask you to do is if I could project you 40 years into the future, and perhaps your careers winding down then and you're reflecting on it? And I say to the words Jude legacy, what is it that comes to mind? What is that legacy you want to have left behind you?
33:33
You know, it's funny how you say, I should be looking, you know, in 40 years, what legacy I should be leaving, but I think there's already one already started. There was this one image and I'll come back to the legacy part in a minute. But I there's this one image, I was in the rebel sports store. And I was looking at a new pair of footy boots. And all I hear is this like, screeching Oh my god, these, this one, this young girl, she was probably about six or seven running towards her mom with these bright pink football boots going, Mom, mom, these are the ones that I want. This is it. This is a football boot that I I want to go and run around in and I was like, I like started tearing and I started going. This is the reason why I did what I did. Because this young girl now has the opportunity to choose any path to be anyone who she wants to be is because of the people that she sees that have paved the way and being trailblazers. And like for me that was that, again was a moment in time where I reflect on and say and continue to push boundaries and continue to stand up for what I believe in. And so I think that there's already a legacy sort of starting, but I would love to leave behind me. Were that there is no difference. If you're a girl or a boy and you're walking down the street and having you know a kick with your mate on the street. That is Girls who play football is normal. Like that's a normal thing that there's boys and girls kicking the footy. And same with boys and girls during a netball laugh for me. It's just about providing opportunity and providing equality across all landscapes of life. And I think for me that this is something that's going to be bigger and it's just going to get better as we continue to live our lives and have people like myself and other people in this world who are pushing those boundaries.[P13]
Paul Barnett 35:29
Penny Kula raid is a pioneer and I thank you very much for your time tonight and inspiring conversation and I can't wait to share it with with a broader group of people the world and he had a react to your story as well. So thank you very much.
35:43
It's been an absolute pleasure pool and happy to speak anytime.
Transition 35:49
The great coaches podcast
Jim Woolfrey 35:52
Hi, everyone, it's Jim here, you've been listening to our chat with the brilliant Penny cooler. Read the highlights for me. When you're leading a team that you were previously part of as a player, learning to believe in yourself as a leader allows you to step away from the players and still have faith in yourself to guide them. Penny's desire to push boundaries so that she can show other women and girls that there is a way if there is something that you really want to do. And her thoughts on getting more females involved in coaching and leadership positions by making them feel more appreciated. Pull open the episode describing the effect Penny story has had on our families. A world where young boys and girls compete equally in sports is an inspirational vision. The reality is, in many countries, perhaps even like the one you're listening to this in, there is still a long journey ahead. The voices and actions from leaders like Penny cooler read, need to be heard. Coming up next on the great coaches podcast, we speak with internationally celebrated basketball coach Olaf Langer.
Olaf Lange 37:04
But the ultimate goal as a coach always for me is to become redundant. Our goal is to create an environment to set high standards, make sure we we as a team that hear the process and play the best to the best of our abilities. And then in the game, I think we should be more of a guardian that we on our team place the right way that we can't be sucked in by the temptations, especially in our game, to over coach from the sides because eventually it will get you it will get you beat because the game is so fast paced that the players have to make decisions and they have to get better at doing them.
Jim Woolfrey 37:48
And just before we go, coaches are not usually the type of people who seek the spotlight. If you can put us in touch with a great coach who has a unique story to share. We would love to hear from you. You can contact us using the details in the show notes.