Tom Reeves edit
Thu, Aug 17, 2023 6:15PM • 39:48
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
horses, kids, work, industry, tom, coach, grew, rodeo, pretty, bucking, helped, good, fundamentals, day, great, school, won, people, ride, coaching
SPEAKERS
Paul Barnett, Tom Reeves
Paul Barnett 00:00
Tom Reeves Good morning, my time and good evening, your time and welcome to the Great coach's podcast. Yeah,
Tom Reeves 00:06
well, good evening. Very, very excited. Good morning. Morning.
Paul Barnett 00:11
Tom, it's great to chat with you. I've been looking forward to this interview for quite a while because you're the you're the first rodeo coach we've had on the on the podcast, but I want to start with something really simple. Where are you in the world? And what have you been up to so far? today?
Tom Reeves 00:28
We're in Big Springs, Nebraska, it's on the western side and Nebraska close to Ogallala. And, and we we've been doing chores, feeding livestock and, and we got a bunch of little girls, my wife, Casey, and they've been helping me. And they're kind of grown up with the with the same same lifestyle. We, we do chores, take care of animals, bucking horses, cattle, and ranch horses. And yeah, and we also have a youth program. So I've been busy with people while I'm doing chores about coming and working with kids and different things like that. So that's kind of what my day is spent. And I actually my wife chewed me out Arsalan some pages, man, she said, You better get over here. We've been pretty excited about this interview and stuff is pretty cool.
Paul Barnett 01:23
So Tom, what I'd like to start with is you say you're out there on the reservation and reading about you had a great childhood? And if I could start with a very broad question, could you tell me about your childhood and how you started learning about horses?
Tom Reeves 01:38
Well, I, I grew up southeast, it could be South Dakota, on the Cheyenne River Indian Reservation. And, and, and we ranch there, and we run cattle and quarter horses and, and getting into rodeo and different things like that is pretty much just a way of life. And, and it's, you know, kind of everything, how I coach and everything goes back to how I grew up, right? Like riding bucking horses and breaking horses and things like that was kind of a rite of passage in that era. Right. So. So it's like, in the old days when, in, in native country, when the kids are growing up, they they hunted. And as ways to prove them, they counted cool on their end and rated installed horses and that's how they grew up. It's ways to prove themselves and warring other tribes. And whatever. So way I grew up, it was breaking horses and riding rodeo was big, big way rite of passage when I was growing up, everybody, we have probably 350 kids in our school, high school. And over 100 of them were on the rodeo team. And pretty much every one of them experienced that were boys of course, that were on a rodeo team they they got on bucking horses and bulls at one time or the other. Whether they kept it up or whatever, they they experienced it. Does that make sense? Some of us yes, some of us took it further and, and went on with it and made it a way to make a living and things like that made it alive. But yeah, it was a great way to grow up. I went through Indian boarding school from the time I was five years old, all the way up. I mean, when they started running buses out we check ourselves in or out of the dorm. And, but for any sport I went out for and I went out for all of them, we'd have to check ourselves in the dorm because it's too far after school to get home, right?[PB1]
Paul Barnett 03:50
So you're growing up on this having this wonderful childhood experience. It sounds very freeing, it sounds very authentic and very real. And then from the age of eight, you're still competing in rodeo competitions. And by your teenage but your teenage years you're competing against the best rodeo riders in the world and what I actually wanted to ask you about the seas i understand that your father to four children how was this experience of having such a freeing childhood and it at the same time such an intense childhood? Has this shaped you as a father?
Tom Reeves 04:26
Well, it you know that I've actually been married and divorced in between me and my wife. We actually all total we have nine daughters and one son so we got more than four. So we actually got it pretty large house so we got five daughters in the house now and what it's done for me and how I like to raise kid is, um I'm a little I like our kids to be kind of free and give them a lot of freedom and let him I don't hold them close and pamper them. I like I have daughters and I raised them, like I would a little boy. And I mean, to some extent, there's some things you can't do with little girls, but I mean, shouldn't, but my little girls are gonna end up breaking horses and, and it's their rodeo company, and it's their youth program and, and they're gonna grew up helping and knowing our industry and breaking horses and ranching. And everything we put together, I hope in the men they marry, I hope they carry it. And, and so I am, I got a lot of freedom, and I want my girls to be tough, I don't want them to sit in the house and look in the mirror and put on makeup all day. I don't want them to be feminine also, right. So it's kind of a healthy twist, I would like to think,
Paul Barnett 05:50
um, when I was preparing to chat with you, I was watching footage of radios, I didn't know a lot about it to learn. And when I watched the bucking horse and seeing people fall off, but then get back on, I just thought it was a great analogy for life. So I wanted to ask you what you've learned about the value of persistence on your journey?
Tom Reeves 06:16
Well, what it's taught me is a lot about coaching, is, no matter what you do, that anything you want to do that's worthwhile, you're gonna fail. At some point, nothing's going to just be hunky dory. And, you know, the climate stay a certain way. And everything, just sunrise be nice. And, you know, storms gonna hit you. I mean, I've had a lot of highs and lows in my life. And in the one thing I've known is kind of stay in the middle, and not get too high or too low. And, and I mean, when, when he leaves just just go right back to fundamentals and start over and give a heck, you know, and that's pretty much it. [PB2] [PB3]
I mean, enjoying the process. I mean, pretty much all the coaching goes right back to the same thing, enjoying the process, and going back to the fundamentals and figuring out what makes you tick. And yeah, you got to enjoy the process, though. I mean, like, I went, I had a long career and, and there was times in my career that I mean, you just kind of burned out. And he just had to reinvent herself go right back to the fundamentals. And remember exactly why he got into the industry in the first place because he loved it. And just the rush, and all excitement of women. And I mean, I insane you gotta agree and love the losing part of it when you get your butt kicked by some of the best guys in our world, in our industry. But by no means you got to get up that morning after, after you've been defeated in in the yearly contest and, and go to them. And, yeah, that's how I coach. And I mean, I'm big on fundamentals. And I'm not pick on not so much on tapes. I'm big on on feeling how you ride. I'm big on going right back to the fundamentals, especially starting a kid from scratch. [PB4]
I mean, you gotta have a feeling. If he's, if he's constantly going back to tapes, when you're first starting it, it's, it's so hard to to learn saddle, bronc run ball, right and then bareback ride, and learn how to control your fear that watching the tape of of making all these mistakes, you're constantly gonna be on it down. So if you're hunting a feeling off a spur, Borden and a mechanical instrument and, and setting your day up around, watching Good tapes of the best drives in history from some of the best competitors that have ever been in our industry. That's the feeling you're looking for. And so I'm, I'm big on hunting and filling fundamentals and enjoying the process. And, and I think if all of our youth I think that's pretty much what are a lot of what our programs about is enjoying the process.[PB5]
Paul Barnett 09:19
I know that you feel very passionate about youth development, and we're gonna get onto your coaching career in a minute but perhaps if you could just tell us a little bit more about the program that you run today.
Tom Reeves 09:32
Well, we pretty much the same thing like we, we do a lot of we invite kids in and they don't all get on buck and horses but let them be a part of it. Even if they the right size or or if you know like the down if they're overweight or whatever. We do have a workout program that goes with it so it helps those kids. We challenge make everybody feel welcome Does that make sense and and we let them all experience it as far as they want to go with it. And no we never turn a kid away like we're doing the school and ranch in Texas a month or so ago and actually an Australian friend of mine Cody England was picking up buck and horse as far as and and helped me train kids long with Terry Smith another kid that went to school for me and and in the past and anyway, they're very good help by the way. And, and there's some kids walking down the street and and they're kind of looking over there he can tell or kind of want to be a part of it. And and Cody ways mauvais and I say me, you know kit jumps up fencing comes over there and and I asked him I said hey, you want to you know first is one kidney city you want to be part of this is it? Yeah. So I go over there and i i run him through the the drills and everybody else kept on working with the kids Noreen and I run it through about half hour drills on bucket machine or spurt board and grabbed him some equipment and come back over there and I said do you want to get on and he said thing right? I mean kid was fit he could tell and and and he he said heck yeah I want on sub put him on and and I mean it what your subconscious mind can do so powerful. And how we coach it proved it. And I run him over there and he has no bad habits has never written the saddle horse before. He had been on a couple of bulls with no training. You know, it's nothing but a bad experience he gets on this bronc and does really well. Actually one of the best rides ever seen for a first time or with with no, no prior engagement, the western lifestyle. Really, other than a bad experience right and a boy with no coaching. And when he hangs it on this, this Bronk really good and comes back and yeah, we got physical kidneys from Hawaiian his mother's from Japan and his dad's a Hawaiian tattoo artists that's done a lot of kid I mean, yeah, and so that's kind of what our program is about. And the kids now on Ryan buck and horses and, and their family lives right next to our training facility in Rancho Texas. And then we have had about five this buddy show up the next day and, and same deal. And a couple of them were on probation. So we work with kids like that we don't if they want to be a part of it, they can hang out this. That's what we do.
Paul Barnett 12:39
So Tom in 2005, you became the coach of the Ranger college rodeo team. Now that same thing existed for 23 years and you weren't big enough at the time to bring any top recruits to that team. However, just a couple of years later you win the national championship. I'm really keen to hear about what you did to drive that result.
Tom Reeves 13:01
Yeah, well we we had limited funds for we couldn't attract the high end guys so much because it wouldn't rancher Texas isn't I love it there and don't get me wrong but our facility was not not to par we're building it up still today but you know we had to work on the Rena for two or three months before we could use it. It and and wedding and real pretty setting and and our nothing but but we it's kind of a little rough set town at the time and and so we we had limited scholarship funding to get kids and what we did have was access to high end friends of mine that would help coach like time Murray, Justin McBride. Jim sharp guys like this. And I don't know if you're familiar with Justin McBride won that PBR. And he recruited one guy from a from his hometown. And a week after Justin had won that PBR. You know, a week before for he went out there I said, after you win that PBR, the professional, Burnside said you're gonna come back and help us he said, Oh, yeah, yeah, I'll come down and help him. So a week after he had won that PBR and and I mean, it's pretty, pretty neat deal. He calls me and say Tom Brady got me Stan, I said, Who is this? And he said, it's just a McBride. I said, I'm gonna come help you coach those kids. So so he hung out there a week. Pick the guitar. I mean, help kids get on bulls Bronx, did everything and that that's how we want to we we surrounded those kids with, with professionals like Justin McBride. Ty Murray. Raymond Hall Abon, the time to vent side and guys of that caliber I mean, I'm leaving a lot of guys out, but it wasn't a Tom Reeves program. I, I had Kalin Wardell helped me with a couple bareback riders. And he recruited a guy named Jared Smith, who's one of the best hands ever saw Stephen dent, but he worked with these guys.
So I specialized I called in buddies that were the best in the field in their particular event. It wasn't about Tom raves is about taking those kids to the top, so they could make a living and fulfill their own goals. So that's how we want to it was about me calling on a bunch of friends that, that were the best in our industry for coaching. And they, they helped, and they're a selfless bunch. And that's how we want it. It wasn't just me, it was, it was me calling on those guys knowing what they could do, if we specialize them. And, anyway,[PB6]
Paul Barnett 15:58
now, Tom, I've heard you talk about your coaching philosophy, actually, you never ever talk about the Tom Reese style at all, you always talk about the theme of empowerment. And I'd really love to hear how would one of your students experience empowerment?
Tom Reeves 16:18
Well, I, I think work in a mountain getting on the numbers and stock at at a younger age. And, and a lot of them have never been on, see women. And I gotta add in the law that a lot of these kids never have rodeo real hard. And, and a lot of them have been over coached. And, and, and I can see that a lot of them have the fundamentals down. And so when I do is I want to surround them with winning philosophies, and, and just day to day extremes to get nonstock. And if you can put these kids in a professional atmosphere as soon as they show up, I make him get a pro card, in turn pro. So they're competing against the best guys in the industry. I surround them with that type of atmosphere. So they more or less think there's no way out. [PB7]
Does that make sense? It doesn't make sense. It, it works in to, uh, in a lot of guys want a different approach, they want you to go back to the amateurs and in and work your way up that way. And, and I like how I learned growing up because I turned pro when I was 16 and, and I was surrounded by the best guys in our industry.
And I had a great mentor. And, and I have a lot of help. But also, I was also turned loose and more or less and, and I kind of was raised in industry by the industry. And it was a very good thing for me. And because as a pretty wild and when as a kid and on the reservation and stuff and and I'm not blaming that on the reservation or anything but I was more or less totally set a young age and I had great parents, they taught me how to work and but I was surrounded by the best guys in the industry when I was competing against. And so So I learned a lot from from the guys as competing against also. And in back then we'd go to 150 rodeos a year, there was no limits. So I learned how to ride in a pros, right and against the best guys in the industry. [PB8]
So how I learned it is kind of how I like to coach the kids. Does that make sense? So when we practice where other rodeo coaches have their kids get on once or twice a week when we're there at school, I would have them practice about every night where they're at least be doing something that the rain or getting on bucking horses or something. And so and then yeah, that that's how I did it. I mean, it works. I like I'm banging heads against the best guys in the industry.[PB9] [PB10]
Paul Barnett 19:26
Tom You mentioned you mentor them. Could you could you tell us about your mentor
Tom Reeves 19:31
John Macbeth helped me from the time I was 14 and I went to school my dad I'd been on a lot of boats and stuff when I was a little boy and in broke lots of horses and we were raised pretty rough and and broke lots of horses that were raised kind of like bucking or say run wild and get them in broke them from time is very young, but But John kinda was a very good coach. He sent a few guys to The theory is goes to Hall of Fame. And John was very good with the equipment and fundamentals. And he was kind of out of the box early on in our industry. And he taught a certain way. And it really worked for me didn't have to have as much strength. And I mean, at 14 years old, I weighed 110 115 pounds. And, and they didn't baby us none when we went to the schools and, and so, yeah, and through my dad teach me how to work and lots of horsemanship and things like that. It his fundamentals worked.
Paul Barnett 20:37
Yeah, you've got a real focus on learning the fundamentals, learning the, in some ways, the old fashioned way getting on horses, not watching tapes being very practical. So how do you feel about some of the controversies that around the rules that are actually happening and rodeo at the minute?
Tom Reeves 20:57
Well, I, I kind of approach them head on I, I'm, I would guess some outspoken maybe not as much as I used to be as director for 10 years. And, and, and I attacked a lot of issues that needed to be attacked. And, and as pretty selfless in doing it, because it costs me some world titles and things like picking horses for short rounds. And in going up against, I mean, some of the stuff I really don't even care to go into like, like I battled it out with countries, how they weren't fair, and how they set entries and things like that. And, and we won. And, and so, some of those controversial things have carried on through generations, and they remember what I did, and I made our industry better. And I served on the board for 10 years, when we're, you know, I remember being 1.5 million down and serving on the board. And bringing it back 14 million in two years. And, and we had a very good commissioner at the time, and a very good board, and that stick together and we played by the rules. And and so me watching our industry grow like that, when kids are breaking rules in our events, and, and breaking in again and be breaking records in there breaking the rules, and not having to go by those rules. And it it's hard to take when you've watched your industry be down and how they grow up. And and so it's coming from a whole different spots and serving on the board and being director and things like that for 10 years and picking stock for the NFR 10 years. And so, yeah, you get you get a heck of an animal husbandry too. Yeah, I would get to see you have a love and passion for the, for the animals as much as you do the competitors.[PB11]
Paul Barnett 23:04
It sounds like fairness is very important to you. Is it part of is it at the center of your coaching style?
Tom Reeves 23:13
Yes. Yeah, it is. I mean, if I mean you're, you're pretty much really not competing against the other guys that are entered. You're, you're competing with the horse, you're trying to make the horse better, and make the best ride you can on the horse. And, and well i rodeo then well I coached in college. I every kid in that in the region when I was coaching would come practice with us. And we even coached on other kids. And I helped all of the kids and in some markets it asked why we're helping all these other kids. And I said I said where you're at now in your career is you're always going to need some help. And and those guys are going to be the guys who Rodian with I said if you can't beat them in a practice pen you're not going to beat them at the rodeo and you're really not beaten them anyway you're you're just seeing who can ride the best animal it's and and that's kind of how I looked at it. So I I pretty much coached the way I wrote it i i helped competitors Kevin get their equipment, right. And I always did. Even if they you know, I helped the guy named Scott Johnson from from Australia. A lot and and and he's one of the best bronc riders ever saw. He didn't win a world title but if he had stayed over here he would you need to stay a little longer. In early did.[PB12]
Paul Barnett 24:42
Tom you say that the outside of a horse is good for the inside of a person. Could you tell us about a change you've helped make with someone by doing this
Tom Reeves 24:56
where you can really see it and see it quick as we kids We work with a lot of kids and, and you see a little, a lot of different kids and struggles are going through in their own life. And in in a rite of passage is one thing, but other things is like we work with some autistic kids. And in we have an autistic kid, that's very going to be a very good bronc rider. And, and with and you could see from the first time he come here, and to being around livestock and get non livestock to, to what he is now today. I mean, he was timid, he wouldn't look in the eye. I mean, now you see him and, and you'd never know. Not Not that I'm downplaying autism or anything but it Hackie has a I mean, he has a good luck and girlfriend, he he is at the prom. He's a he's stepped outside of it, and, and is really doing well. I mean, it that's one experience and there's countless others and, and even if they don't get on just a sense of belonging and being around and, and working with the livestock and running them up the chute and flank and tying horses in and just being around the atmosphere. I mean, in my opinion, if we had horsemanship in every high school, in America and all over the world, it would do a lot for the youth in our inner world. I know it would for sure. And it's it's huge. I think what it can do, and there's so many breakups in our industry, too, in the equine industry from horse race and their Saj I mean, horse shoe and veterinarians. I mean, it's huge. And, and, and the the basic thing is therapy for everybody in our industries. I mean, going out and patent horses and and we work with a lot of vets, we take good care of our animals, and we stop them. And in knowing what veterinarians go through if they lose an animal or or if they can save one is it's extraordinary what they do. And so we see that every day working with horses, it's yeah, a horses are a lot like people in every way. I think. So. Yeah.
Paul Barnett 27:45
You mentioned Kelly Wardell earlier. I've actually got this quote from Kelly about you. He says, Tom really cares about the kids. And he's every bit as dedicated as a coach, as he was as a competitor. And just listening to you now your your drive, your deep desire to help care for others comes through. But where does this drive for this need or this requirement in your life to care for others? Where does it come from?
Tom Reeves 28:14
I think wanting to achieve things. And enemy just having a passion for the industry. Like leaving a mark is one thing. But if you can help people in the right way. It's huge.
Paul Barnett 28:40
Tom, you participated in the Olympics, the Command Performance rodeo, and you were chosen by the team to be a captain. Now when you look for other people to lead now, whether it's helping on the teams that you coach, whether it's helping on the farm, when you look for other people to lead, what traits are really important for you, what do they need to have?
Tom Reeves 29:03
I think work ethic is the main thing. You know, if if they got drive, in work ethic, and and that was the main thing I had, but I had a passion for riding bucking horses since I was five years old. But But I think you can still, I mean, you can instill that passion and people you know, by coaching the right way and showing them good, healthy experiences and, and that's what I had. I had a dad and mom that really instilled that in me. They instilled the work ethic you know. [PB13]
So, yeah, like we we didn't really have running water or a phone system. Tell us about 13 And then I was visiting with a guy and invite a mine. He's sort of like a medicine man tech guy, but in a way but does a lot of work within equine. And in horses when he's delivering his message and, and he grew up a lot like I did and, and we never knew we didn't have money and all those things, and we always had something to eat. And that was always a pleasant atmosphere pretty much, you know, but, but we had to work in every sense. I can remember we did chores and, and my sisters did it ride along with us and, and we grew up tough. But we always broke horses. My my grandpa put some of the first horses in the registry in American Quarter Horse still, we, we he was honored. The other day in Fort Worth, we went to that. It's, it was a great way to grow up. So we grew up breaking horses and working cattle and yeah. Yeah, it was. It was pretty cool. Actually looking back I'm grateful. You know, and, and it's funny to hear people talk and about how they grew up and, and a lot of people are similar but but they look at it in more of a negative light. And I look at it where they got me ready to go rodeo and being in a dorm. I was away from home and lonesome for my family a lot with my mom and dad. But But I mean, it got me ready to rodeo and that's what I wanted to do since as a little boy. So it's nothing but positive. I thought, you know, and, and I, like you hear the horror stories about Indian boarding school, our Indian boarding school wasn't like that. We had we had everybody knew our dorm matrons, and they were, they were natives to and Native Americans and, and family members, a lot of the kids that were being housed there. And it was a good experience. To me. I mean, I wish that bring it back to our reservation. I think it could help a lot. And we still work with a lot of tribes and things and it's pretty rewarding. In Indian, non Indian, we work everywhere. And when I talk about working with tribes, I don't I'm not racist in by any means. I like working with every kid. And but but there is there is a soft spot in my heart.
Paul Barnett 32:56
I want to talk a little bit about that, that heart of yours because I've got another interesting quote from you, Tom. And you say, if I could have applied what I know, now, when I was a kid, I would have won a lot more titles, I would have won more gold buckles. I only won one. Now I'm really intrigued. Tom, what are some of the things that you know now, but you didn't know them?
Tom Reeves 33:25
You know, I then like the way I was raised, i i always blame it on that. And, and my one time somebody said so and so is Marva people person then Tom is another world champion, says man. And my brother said, Well, did that kid go to Indian boarding school? And have the app just go go with everybody's asked? Or get your ass whipped? If shit didn't go right in school that day with your fellow competitors. And and, and they said we'll probably not. So that's how it was for us. And I in San is a bad place to grow up for anything but but that is how we grew up. And and if you had to have a doubt you went and had it out. And whereas anyway, and you kind of grew up on your own a little bit and where what I would have did different. I'd have kept my coach my whole career. I know my personality, I still would have stuck up for everything in our industry. I might say I wouldn't, but that's bullshit. I still I'd still try and play by the rules. I'd still want to grow help grow our industry. And even if I had to be outspoken to do it, but there are things like keeping a coach I keep behind coach and send them to Some myself and and have them get inside people to see how my attitude is. And I'd have them calling interviewing me. And I do things like that. And in knowing that I would have one more, and they could have told me if I was being a horse's ass or, or does that make sense. But there are other ways, but I think if more people in our industry were more direct, and straightforward, and leave the politics aside, and let the judges write it down. And I think our industry would be a better place. And I think if more people would stick up for our industry and try and do the right thing, I think it would be even greater. I think we'd be we're getting closer to big money and in our industry, and and I'm looking forward to that day. But getting closer to that day isn't going to be by a bunch of people. backstabbing everybody, it's going to be by people moving forward with the right intentions.
Paul Barnett 36:08
Tom, you do a lot of work now. On the prevention of suicide and drug abuse for local youths. Through equine therapy, you talked about it earlier. How does this challenge compare to riding in a world championship?
Tom Reeves 36:24
It to me, it's the very same, it's enjoying the process, and a peaking get kids to do the same thing. It it just kind of is right in tune with coaching. And the same thing if you could get them hooked on our industry, and the western lifestyle and spending time with horses and getting a passion for something other than drugs and whatever else is, is messing with them. I mean, it it runs frighten right hand in hand with our industry. And that's why I talked earlier about if we could get horsemanship classes and things like that inside our hearts, high schools and in grade schools all all through all across the world. I mean, that the outside of a horse is good for the inside of a man I mean, it the prevention side of that is I mean it, it gets it get kids outside of their own mind and in and shows some something positive if they're in a bad light.
Paul Barnett 37:32
Don't just one final question if I can. You've been a world champion. You've coached national champions, you've done work with your local community. You've had a great career and you've touched a lot of lives. And when it's all said and done, what is it that you hope is the legacy that you're remembered for?
Tom Reeves 37:55
I think, pretty much going right back to what I said and somebody that enjoy the process and, and try to help everybody along the way. That's I want to leave my mark and and I want to win everything but but I still want to help people. And I like coaching kids. And I'd like to see my kids stay in industry. You know, my daughter's and, and yeah, I got a whole new bunch to raise and, and I hope they marry well. As far as somebody that likes our industry, if, if they're passionate about our industry, they'll make money in it and do well. But when I say marry well, like I hope they they married somebody that enjoys our industry and loves bucking horses and ranch horses and and I guess my legacy would be bringing more as many people as I can into the western lifestyle. And if I could ever get horses in the schools, that would be great. You know, and, and I know that's a that's a long cry from started but but what what animals can do for kids is phenomenal. And horses expecially you know, they're the most lovable creatures there is.
Paul Barnett 39:26
Tom, it's been a real honor to spend an hour with you today preparing for this interview opened up a whole new world to me, and I was absolutely fascinated by it. And your story is a really inspiring and amazing one and I thank you for being with us.
Tom Reeves 39:43
Thank you, appreciate you. Thanks for your time. I really enjoyed it.