Trevor Gleeson Edit

Sun, 12/19 4:40AM • 19:55

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

coach, players, coaching, play, bit, relationships, basketball, team, year, championship, self belief, fortunate, wildcats, coaching philosophy, successful, important, head coach, nbl, win, organization

SPEAKERS

Jim Woolfrey, Trevor Gleeson

Jim Woolfrey 00:00

Trevor Gleason, welcome to the podcast. Let me start by saying or asking, Where are you? And what have you been up to today?

Trevor Gleeson 00:07

Yeah, man, I'm in Perth, Australia comes in handy to be one in the most isolated cities in the world. And we've had practice this morning already with our guys, individual workouts and in the gym. So you got me in a good time.

Jim Woolfrey 00:20

Fantastic. You're getting prepared for the season? I guess that's kicking off in December. Okay, let's jump straight in and have a chat to you about you as a coach. Trevor, we ask all our great coaches the question, what person or events started them on their coaching journey? Your passage into coaching was a life changing event as a young man? How did that adversity shape you as a coach,

Trevor Gleeson 00:41

I was pretty involved in sport at a young age and have an accident when I was 18 years old. It was a major impact is all I knew was sport. So that was really the catalyst of me getting into coaching to still stay involved with basketball and turned in film, something to stay involved with and evolved the passion over many, many years. And I've been very fortunate now to be coaching professionally, for nearly three decades. So I'm very lucky and still have those principles from when I coach now to when I started coaching and being curious, your curiosity that you have to find out the best treatment, the best way to communicate the best skills, the best techniques that's still alive today and everything I do,

[PB1]

Jim Woolfrey 01:23

we'll come back and talk about some of that curiosity today. But I just want to sort of start back over your career you've drawn from the great coaches around you in both Victoria, Australia and your time overseas. What is the role of a head coach today in basketball? And how have you seen this change during your career,

Trevor Gleeson 01:40

the coach has changed immensely. Since I first started it was more so of jumping in the players that say how high and now as a coach, you say jump and they say why. And then again, they say what's in it for me. So totally different in the spectrum that I've coached in, but it's provide leadership, provide coaching and developing your players, the players want to see themselves develop individually, and they want to be involved in team success[PB2] . But I would still say the majority would say Individual Development first. And we're very big on a in person. That was one of the big areas, I wanted to be the best place in Australia where kids wanted to go to learn how to play basketball. And to get an environment where there's no egos, the egos are on the hook. We just have one egos a team ego where we can play and there's no politics and we play the right way of sharing the game and sharing the ball with each other and the guys, reciprocate that and it's an fun environment to be in. And when you're in a fun environment, you get players playing at their peak performance.[PB3]

Jim Woolfrey 02:48

I mentioned that you'd coach both locally and internationally. And you went to the MBL 400 club last year. Congratulations on reaching such a fantastic milestone. It places you alongside the most iconic names of the Australian MBL names like gorgi and gays, black curls, right McLeod, what is it that great coaches do differently that gives them this longevity, that constant

Trevor Gleeson 03:11

change, you got to keep evolving. And when you bring those names up, I was very fortunate to grow up in country Victoria. And down in in Melbourne, we had a number of four or five MBL teams and we had Lindsay guys, you know, I learned a lot off of Bruce Palmer, Brian gorge and Brett Brown. These were guys that I would go down each weekend and watch them practice during the week play on the weekend, try to sneak into a pregame conference in there. There's some of the great coaches that have walked Australian basketball and then my first coaching job was with a guy called Brian curl, curly won four championships to at St Kilda to Brisbane. And that was my first three years in the NBL as a development officer under curly and and just to learn how they operate every day and how they communicate and how they work the media, how to work your board members, your stakeholders. It was just a great learning curve for us. And I was able to take bits and pieces from those coaches along the way and kind of molded into my own little philosophy and that constantly changes with different influences you have along the way. And I worked a little bit in AFL football and got the clst clocks and work and firsthand with an elite side in Hawthorne. And there's some of those things that you take along the way and you adapt them to yourself and tell us in your system or your coaching philosophy.

Jim Woolfrey 04:34

What would you say is the best piece of coaching advice you've ever received?

Trevor Gleeson 04:37

One thing I've learned when the team wins praise the players and when the team lose take responsibility and I think that just takes the pressure off the players and sure puts me in the firing line a fair bit but after a while you grow a thick skin with that kind of stuff but it's you want the players don't feel the pressure of the outside environment but also reward for high You want to see repeated so certainly those lines[PB4]

Jim Woolfrey 05:03

comes with the territory as a head coach, I guess. Much you started speaking about the Wildcats and you joined the Perth Wildcats in 2013. They were already a five time championship winning franchise. However, when you joined, they were coming off back to back grand final defeats yet in your first year you coach them to their sixth championship, what is your advice to leaders on how to help teams create focus and motivation when they are so far behind their goals?

Trevor Gleeson 05:30

Establish Rob was already here, it was already a good organization. And my challenge, I guess was taken to that great challenge, right organization with that, and I didn't really have to reinvent the wheel a lot. There was a lot of good stuff around the area. But we also we wanted to change the direction a little bit and focus a little bit me more being prioritize what we need. And that was probably a ruthless decisions to get key points across and to have clear outcomes that we wanted to proceed with. And once everybody was heading in the right direction, we were okay. And that was a great year because there was I think we brought in four or five different players at that stage different imports, but the buying from our players was there straightaway. And that helps us success when you got guys willing to be coached and willing to change the direction makes it a little bit more easy to coach the team.

Jim Woolfrey 06:22

Obviously, those ruthless decisions played some dividends because since that time, the Wildcat you've coached the Wildcats to five NBL titles, the last two being back to back. How do you get the squad to reset after success and not move forward with complacency and a sense of entitlement?

Trevor Gleeson 06:39

Yeah, that's a good question. We've covered that a number of times. And we've been very fortunate to make sure every year is different. We don't talk about last year and what was last year because there's different personnel, there's a different league, there's different options, opponents people chain, so it was more. So this is what worked in the past. If we work hard enough, we'll give ourselves the best opportunity of winning. It wasn't building that pressure on that, hey, listen, we won it last year, we're going to win it again this year, it's certainly a different set of goals that we have, then it's something that we sit down the start of the year with the players. And our goal is not to win the championship. Although we always want to win the championship, it is we want to finish in the top two, and then we give ourselves a great chance. And then we adjust our goals as we go on along. Again, that takes pressure off the guys just to play more relaxed, and we're not over analyze everything and be when you win a championships the following year, you always judging against that year. And I think that doesn't help you, it actually hinders your performance. Because the players feel the responsibility. If they don't perform up to that expectations.[PB5] And we can't do anything about the past, we were very fortunate to win that's in the history books. Now. Let's create something new. And when you do that, you're a little bit more liberated to play a certain style and to incorporate different things. And that's one thing that you're going to have to do is keep changing a little bit along the way. And we have been that along the way. So far.

Jim Woolfrey 08:09

I've listened to you in many interviews describe your coaching philosophy as being passionate, you only have to really watch an NBA game with the Wildcats playing to see this expression firsthand on the side of a court, what are the behaviors and values you hold central to this,

Trevor Gleeson 08:23

I try to relax a little bit. And if you had to say me early days, I was a little bit more crazy a bit. There's obviously some non negotiables. But about the passion is playing, I guess every play, it's the relationship that you have with the players to allow me to be that way. If I don't have a relationship with a player, and we have a very robust conversation in the heat of the battle for 10 seconds, that event could cause a lot of trouble. If I haven't built up the trust and relationship with their player and everyone's different, how are we communicate, but we also have some non negotiable team standards that I guess you say that we're not going to be successful if we don't achieve them. And sometimes you might lose the game. But if you drop in those standards of the performance that you play, you're going to let yourself down and that's where I come in and say hey, that's not good enough. That's not what we represent here at the Wildcats. That's not Wildcats basketball. And if we take care of those things, normally the scoreboard take care of itself.[PB6]

Jim Woolfrey 09:25

The walkouts recently signed not Radames John Mooney for the new season. I saw a recent tweet the club posted where John said, Coach Gleason is always talking about relationships and rings. What did those symbols and words mean for you?

Trevor Gleeson 09:39

It's something that was kind of developed here and we stole it from another player that why you're here. It's the relationships that you build. We're going to battle 12 players or 15 players. And then we have our coaching staff, support staff, office staff. And if you don't have great relationships in Denver to be successful, there's going to be hindered it's going to be split speed bumps along the way. And to build those relationships takes time. It doesn't happen. It's our offense, relationships, our defense, relationships, our communication, all those things are vitally important to know that we're trying to get the best out of you. Not necessarily the best for me or the best for anybody else. But the team. So we go every day that every practice, we want to play for game five for the grand final, we're challenging for a championship, we want to play for rings and build relationships along the way.[PB7]

Jim Woolfrey 10:31

And what advice do you have for coaches or leaders who are new into their roles, and they want to create a set of those values or better values for their team to aspire to?

Trevor Gleeson 10:41

Yeah , I probably look backwards, I look back, it was okay, if you're gonna lose, how do you want to lose. And for us, it was like we want to play, we want to be the hardest working team out there. Okay. And we understand we can be the hardest working team and lose a game. So it was for me, it was working backwards to that standard, let's be the hardest working team out there. And that gives us a chance to win and win consistently. And I think if you have some of those areas, when you first come into being a leader you willing to put up with or what would you let slide to be a leader and constant leaders that I've gone have researched and follow through, they're very consistent of doing the right thing over a long period of time. And normally, the scoreboard and the results come out of that don't chase results straight away, because you're not going to get there, you might get there for one year, and you're not going to get there the following is it's how you build that up how the culture is how your organization is, then the relationships come then the trust comes. And then the success comes out of that those things are controllable, when that's important to be successful.[PB8] [PB9]

Jim Woolfrey 11:45

So when you're trying to improve a team's culture, what should you be doing first?

Trevor Gleeson 11:49

Well, the first thing is for leader values and your behaviors every day, it's it's not about do what I say it's about what you do. And it's like if I say we want to be the hardest working team here, and I get into the office last in the office in first out the door, am I really doing the things that I'm saying we have a pretty strong work ethic here. And guys get in early because they want to improve. And if I'm taking shortcuts, that's noticed by everybody. So we follow through with the values and behaviors that we do as the culture is done every day. It's not one often in taking shortcuts,[PB10]

Jim Woolfrey 12:27

you obviously a coach who embodies self belief, and I've heard you speak saying one of your key strengths is that you can get guys to buy into the bigger picture. How do you coach this?

Trevor Gleeson 12:38

You got to have that relationship with the one on one and you find out what the players what motivates the players, some players might be motivated because their family they might be motivated because of money, they might be motivated because a championship so MVP, so we sit down with guys, what's important to you. And it kind of opened my eyes up a few years ago when I did this. And I asked one of our foreign players, I mean, four players, and why do you play? He said, Well, if I didn't play, I'll be dead to the kids that I grew up with died with gunshots and basketball saved my life. And I said well, okay, that's very powerful, that's emotional. So every time you step on the foot, let's represent that. Let's represent how you apply it. And you do that with not how many points or rebounds you get. It's how the level that you play. So it's finding that individual button from the players and when you find that it's an easy transition. Now I'm going to help you bring the best out of you with that if you know find out you can't just paint the whole team the same same Avenue so that individual relationship and finding out what's important to the player. That's a big key to being successful.[PB11]

Jim Woolfrey 13:45

You sweat out the connections to individuals and being finding out what is that most important aspect that drives a player to behave and react the way they do. Have you though had to manage your influence disruptive peer pressure within a team,

Trevor Gleeson 13:59

he always gonna have some time the old cyan is one bad apple can ruin the Lighten in professional sport. We're always against that, especially with ESPN show on the highlights of dunks and selfish play and taken away team aspects and when really emphasize, reward and recognize things that you want repeated. So we constantly unlock in video review, if there's an extra pass, the guy doesn't get any credit for to make the pass. Or maybe he does two screens that we emphasize those things that help you be successful. And that eliminates a lot of the individualism in team sports. So we've been very lucky. [PB12]

And the other thing that we do we do a really deep search and making sure we get the right people into the organization. It's a lot easier to coach good guys than coach bad guys with that. So we've made mistakes along the way without a question and got the wrong personnel but we will take a less talented player, if they have the right values and the right work ethic and the right attitude, then more talented player will let them go and play somewhere else.[PB13]

Jim Woolfrey 15:09

You've had very different coaching experiences at both Brisbane and Melbourne, you were quoted as saying, I was very close to walking away from the game. In moments like these, what are your top tips in dealing with self doubt,

Trevor Gleeson 15:22

I was very close to walk away, it was just the basketball and thought my life would be heading in a different direction more of a business path with team coaching and organizing companies. But I've been very fortunate to have great backing from parents at an early age that always gave me that self belief. And it's really to look back where you come from, and the self belief, not necessarily where you want to go, and maybe you haven't reached that yet, it's more tick off the box and look where you came from. Okay, I came from this organization, this small, little population, that gives you confidence. And I remember when I first went over to America that coached in Australia as a development coach, and I didn't really have anything to hang my head on in American, and I got to America, and a lot of people tell him that would tell people how good they are. And that just wasn't mean. And I said, Well, I can't match these stories and losing experience. So I'm just going to roll my sleeves up and be the first one in the gym. And if a kid wants to shoot you for half an hour before the camp, I'll be there. If he wants to shoot half an hour after camp, I'll be there. And I'll do it again. And, and I met a great relationship with a guy and he finished up getting the head coach and see my work ethic and asked me to be assistant coach. And so those things that you can control for self belief that gives you energy, certainly don't look ahead where you want to get to, for self belief, have a look at the journey, where you came from.[PB14]

Jim Woolfrey 16:44

And when do you think it's actually important for a coach to step back?

Trevor Gleeson 16:49

Quite often, I like to give my assistant coaches, the freedom and the power to coach you know, I don't want to be overbearing where I do everything. They can make decisions, I want their input. And even though that I want to sometimes talk on top of them or no, this is not the way I think it's important for me to step back and get other people's perspective of what's going on. And then you get a little bit more broader evaluation. And then you maybe that path forward is a little bit clearer. But as I get older and being in this profession, I seek out more advice, still have what I'm doing. In the back of my mind. When I first started coaching it was this my way or the highway, and that time is passed these days. Everybody wants a little bit of input, right? Everyone wants to feel a part of something bigger. And I think stepping back as a coach is a critical thing you got to do[PB15] . You've

Jim Woolfrey 17:43

spoken a bit about the lessons you've learned from your Korea moments from other great coaches. What other resources have you found helpful as a coach,

Trevor Gleeson 17:52

look, I've been very fortunate to meet some great coaches along the way. And they're still mentors today. And I can pick a phone up from a coach in America and they'll get back to me in the next 24 hours and acts from advice. And it's good to get advice from mentors outside your bubble. We get so engrossed in what we're doing and everything that could be seems to us such a big issue outside the bubble that might be only a small issue that you're blowing up and to have that liberty and ability to call some NBA coaches, AFL coaches, rugby league coaches, and to have that broad base that you can get some different ideas and their key for big moments to travel. [PB16] This

Jim Woolfrey 18:35

is my last question today. Your story so far is one of leadership, self belief and overcoming adversity. What legacy Do you believe you are leaving as a coach,

Trevor Gleeson 18:47

he handful I haven't really thought about that. But often talk to our guys is we're here the Wildcats and we're very fortunate to work for Jack Ben data great owner, and a great organization's it's played 34 years straight away and in the finals, and we took this is our chance we're carrying the torch to the next bar, I'm not going to be here forever. I'm not going to be here in five years, 10 years. But while we're here, we're carrying the torch forward and making sure we represent ourselves well. And that's a key for us that why you're here and this short little time it could be two years, three years who knows that you're doing the best that you possibly can. So you pass the torch to the next guy, or the next coach or the next player in a little bit better position that you get it in the first place. And I think if you can do that in any industry, you can sit back and be proud of your efforts.[PB17]

Jim Woolfrey 19:36

Trevor, you may have never played the game beyond those younger years in Warrnambool. But I feel that fans of basketball all over the world would see what those traits would have been on the court every time they watch the Perth Wildcats play. It has been an honor speaking with you today. Thank you so much for your time.

Trevor Gleeson 19:52

Thanks Mike. Appreciate it. Not worries at all.